Death In Entertainment
Kyle Ploof, Alejandro Dowling and Ben Kissel discuss Hollywood murders, true crime, on-set deaths and more!
Death In Entertainment
Gene Hackman: The Final Take (Episode 155)
Join us as we pay homage to the late, great Gene Hackman and search for answers today on Death in Entertainment.
Death in Entertainment is hosted by Kyle Ploof, Alejandro Dowling and Ben Kissel.
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Gene Hackman was Hollywood royalty.
Speaker 2:And the Oscar goes to Gene Hackman in Unforgiveness.
Speaker 1:An actor who commanded every scene.
Speaker 3:I don't care what the scoreboard says at the end of the game. In my book, we're going to be winners.
Speaker 1:A legend who walked away at the peak of his game.
Speaker 3:There's no script in front of you, no one's calling.
Speaker 1:Gene.
Speaker 4:Hackman no, it's probably all over in front of you.
Speaker 1:No one's calling Gene Hackman, no, it's probably all over. For years he lived in quiet obscurity at his New Mexico sanctuary with his wife and dogs, but when the credits rolled, the real story was just beginning.
Speaker 5:Gene Hackman and his wife, along with their dog, all found dead in their home.
Speaker 1:Was it old age, accidental overdose or was he murdered by a secret Hollywood cabal? We search for answers today on Death in Entertainment.
Speaker 4:Here in.
Speaker 3:Hollywood now.
Speaker 2:Two counts of murder.
Speaker 5:Injury and death oh my God, shocking new details that has stunned the entertainment world.
Speaker 4:This makes me a little nervous. The hair stood up on my arms.
Speaker 3:Just like in the movies.
Speaker 4:What do you call this thing anyway?
Speaker 1:Death In entertainment.
Speaker 6:Greetings Ditto Universe. How are you? Hello there, what's going on, everybody? My name is Kyle Plouffe.
Speaker 5:I'm Ben Kissel.
Speaker 1:And I'm Alejandro Dowling.
Speaker 5:Make sure to go to the Patreon patreoncom slash diebud Just 10 bucks a month. You can watch every show live Death and Entertainment and OK Bud. I think you will enjoy it. Comment and be a part of the show Today's episode. It's a quick turnaround but there is a lot of suspicion in the air regarding the timely slash, untimely death of Gene Hackman.
Speaker 1:Let's get into it, but first we must warn you that there might be a few chuckles.
Speaker 6:Yes.
Speaker 5:You know, serious stuff, laughter will ensue.
Speaker 6:Yes, so don't get all bent out of shape about it.
Speaker 5:It's gallows humor. It's okay. We're on the brink of World War III, we need to laugh into the abyss.
Speaker 1:If we weren't laughing, we'd be crying, that's right, and with that let's take it away, okay, well, I don't know about you guys, but I never. The ratio has never been this tiny between when my brain was thinking about Gene Hackman and not thinking about Gene Hackman. Okay, you get what I'm saying.
Speaker 6:No, not, really, Not at all.
Speaker 1:Not at all, Alejandro. I went from not really thinking about Gene Hackman that much that now I'm obsessed.
Speaker 5:Yeah Right, this is the unfortunate death of all artists. No one cares about them when they're alive, and then, all of a sudden, they're dead, with their wife and their dog, and now we care.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I was curious what he had been up to, though, yeah, and I sort of found out.
Speaker 5:Interesting because I've seen some pictures and I think he was up to not eating. He was too skinny.
Speaker 6:I'm not going to lie, I thought he was already dead in a way, aren't we all?
Speaker 1:he certainly looked dead in the paparazzi photos that surface. Yes, not too long ago, but we're jumping the gun a little bit, okay, first I would like to take us on a trip to 1930 san bernardino, california hey, get out of here.
Speaker 5:You're not the right race. Hey, they're letting in bars. Now Get the fuck out of here.
Speaker 1:That is when and where. Okay, mr Gene Hackman entered this planet. Wow.
Speaker 6:Because you can't die if you weren't born.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 6:Exactly.
Speaker 1:That's a good point, powerful.
Speaker 5:Powerful.
Speaker 1:His parents were Anna and Eugene and they moved around a bit before settling in Danville, illinois. I know.
Speaker 5:Danville, I've been there.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 5:Yep, how is it Not a guy named Stephen Town?
Speaker 1:So is that like Southern Illinois? I don't know the exact area. Well, no, I'm asking because if it's sort of in the Chicagoland, it's around there. Okay, I'll just say that Way better than Southern Illinois.
Speaker 5:I lived in Wheon illinois, for a little while as well.
Speaker 6:I got kicked out of preschool for sitting on a kid, for making fun of a gal. I liked, oh, yes, indeed it was a real bully.
Speaker 1:It's closer to indianapolis. There you go, gotcha, okay. Well, his dad found work there at the local newspaper. Oh so he was a bit of a newsman, and as a child, gene had to spend a lot of time looking after his grandma while his parents were making a living. Okay, what was wrong with his grandmother? Well, she was probably just old.
Speaker 6:She wasn't looking after him.
Speaker 1:No, he was taking care of her. Wow, that's nice. Yeah, feeding her, changing the diaper.
Speaker 5:That'll lead to something A little Harold and Maude. Yeah, diaper, that'll lead to something A little Harold and Maude.
Speaker 1:Yeah, unfortunately, though, his parents divorced when he was only 13 years old. A tough age to deal with, that, I would say.
Speaker 6:I always felt bad for people who got parents that were getting divorced during high school time, because my parents got divorced when I was two. I don't remember them being together Right. So it was always normal that they weren't together, yeah. And when you see them together and then all of a sudden they hate each other, it's like, oh, that must not be good.
Speaker 5:Yeah, especially at that time in life. You're going through puberty, everything is uncertain, and then you're like, yeah, my parents are divorcing. Yeah, I had a couple of friends go through that as well.
Speaker 1:Yeah, Junior high, that's even harder than high school. I mean it's.
Speaker 5:I'm not going to judge, but I think pre-three years old get it done, and then post-18. Exactly, that's true. You just got to eat it for 15 years. But of course every relationship is different. Yeah, and sometimes a divorce is necessary.
Speaker 1:Well, it gets worse. Oh boy, one fateful day his dad walked by and waved to him. So then he waves back. Oh, hey, dad, see you later. Yeah, can't wait for dinner.
Speaker 6:His dad never came back oh, a pack of cigarettes and out yeah, he did that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, he didn't realize that that was actually a goodbye wave oh that's so sad. Yeah, so post-divorce he ditched the family.
Speaker 6:Wow well, a guy like that you don't really want around anyway I guess not.
Speaker 1:No, but it's devastating yeah, exactly, it's traumatic, right. So, yeah, needless to say, yet is his grandma and his mom then, and he acted out by stealing soda pop and candy from a mom. Pasha, well, that's a good way to act out, it's very 1930s. Very son of a newspaper man hey, you got any of those cracker jacks. He spent some time in juvie jail for that wow which seems kind of harsh for stealing candy.
Speaker 1:I just wanted a soda pop. Hey, what are you in for? Yeah, I stole a ring pop, yeah same same here. I've been here for 16 years oh, also I murdered someone, yeah, but they got me on the ring pop. At 16 he joined the marines hey, at 16 my yeah he school was not for him. Okay, you know, and I don't blame him, it's a lot going on.
Speaker 1:You know, dad left and you know you got to hang out with grandma You're in juvie and that lasted for about four and a half years. Awesome. He wasn't the best Marine, though self-admittedly he just didn't care that much. I get it. He's an actor which you know what. I have heard in interviews that he had a problem with authority. I'm sure he did. Yeah, so that's why he didn't last long in the Marines.
Speaker 5:That would be my major problem, yeah, and later on, he would often have contentious relationships with directors because of that. And it's interesting, because there was many roles where he played a military man. True, there was many roles where he played a military man.
Speaker 1:True, I feel like I remember him mostly in Fatigues. Yeah, like Crimson Tide. Yes, that was a huge one for him. So his mom could sense that he had the acting bug. Although he was a shy kid this is interesting he wasn't going out for the school play.
Speaker 5:Well, a lot of times the school play is full of a bunch of people that it's more of a clique, right it? Of a bunch of people that it's more of a clique Right. It's difficult to join and it's kind of intimidating.
Speaker 6:Yeah, the theater kids are being mean they can bully. They can.
Speaker 1:Oh my goodness, yeah, yeah, so he thought about it, though, kind of like the person that sits near the class clown and thinks of a good joke but then doesn't say it. Yep.
Speaker 5:I was class clown rowdiest and loudest. But I missed class rebel by three votes Went to Tyler and that's the only one. I wanted Fucking Tyler. I know he was a drummer, he was overweight, he was cool.
Speaker 1:Well, of course it's a drummer that wins the rebel. Yeah, I know. So there was another fateful day in young Gene's life. One afternoon he went to see a matinee with his mom and in the lobby afterwards she tells him I want to see you do that that's nice yeah, and he never forgot that, and that was the only time that he and his mom ever discussed acting wow.
Speaker 1:A major influence on him was also james cagney from the public eye and yankee doodle dandy, of course, yankee doodle dandy and I could see that because he sort of carried the torch for james cagney. If you've seen any, probably a lot of people have and I love james cagney, yeah, you know, but he was like a kind of scary, tough, powerful, powerful presence in the movies. So imagine a character named Yankee Doodle Dandy.
Speaker 5:Yeah, very intimidating.
Speaker 1:Or Public Enemy. That's it, the Public Enemy, right, I think I said Public.
Speaker 5:Enemy? Oh yes, Of course I know who that is.
Speaker 1:I said the wrong title. Yes, yeah, but he's pretty menacing.
Speaker 5:Yes, I see this now. Yes, yeah, but he's pretty menacing. Yes, I see this now. Yes, he is quite scary.
Speaker 1:Especially when the medium of film is quite new. It's like boom, like this is what you can do with it.
Speaker 5:you know I remember his image from Turner Classic Movies. Yeah, he was in their like montage before, like every movie they would play.
Speaker 1:Exactly, yeah, so he gave it a go. First back in California. David would go first back in California. So interesting. He starts out in San Bernardino, then goes to Illinois, joins the Marines, then he heads to Pasadena Okay, and he joins the Pasadena Playhouse. Was he hanging out at a Winchell's? No, thankfully.
Speaker 5:Yeah, the old Pasadena Playhouse. Don't bring your kids.
Speaker 1:Yeah, a playhouse, don't bring your kids. Yeah. And he made fast friends with fellow struggling thespians Robert Duvall and Dustin Hoffman. Get out of town and he called him Dusty. Dusty. You know you're close when you call him Dustin Hoffman. Dusty, that's very true.
Speaker 5:He kind of looks dusty.
Speaker 1:And greasy Midnight Cowboy. Definitely Is that the debut of your Hoffman.
Speaker 5:My impression got to go to Kmart, got to get underwear at Kmart, yep.
Speaker 1:So, while at the Pasadena Playhouse get this, he and Hoffman were both voted least likely to succeed.
Speaker 5:What the fuck is that? It's a popularity contest. They didn't say the right thing to the prettiest guy there.
Speaker 1:And they're like we hate these two. Yeah, and that's kind of unfortunate that he was afraid to go out for the school play. Then he finally gets the guts to join the playhouse and they say you suck yeah.
Speaker 6:Why would they even vote on that Like it's a creative place?
Speaker 5:it's like you schmucks aren't gonna make it I'm telling you they're brutal, their actors are brutal, yeah thanks for your money and paying for all these classes, but exactly you ain't gonna come out of here with anything it's like people in ucb 12, oh god I'm on level 12. They told me the next level is snl.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no, it's not, I promise that's what I was told in Chicago, and boy did I take out my credit card.
Speaker 6:Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1:Still paying that off.
Speaker 5:for that, open mics are free. They are. And starting a comedy troupe is free, not always, not always Five bucks. Maybe you shouldn't be spending thousands of dollars. Go learn in front of a crowd, in front of a live crowd.
Speaker 1:They'll let you know how you are. That's true. Hackman then fled to new york city and he said I'm gonna show them. And hoffman followed close behind. Wow, gene met and married a woman named faye maltese no relation to the maltese falcon or the dog or the dog and eventually they had three kids son, son Christopher, and daughters Elizabeth and Leslie. So Dusty stayed on the kitchen floor, their kitchen floor. Can you imagine this One off the couch?
Speaker 6:Newlyweds yeah, but one off the couch Because he's Dusty. He's got to be on a linoleum. You can clean it this year.
Speaker 1:It's a New York apartment. It was probably pretty tiny, okay, maybe the living room was the kitchen. That's possible, true, and you know they had fun together. One of the things they would do is pretend they were marlon brando and play the bongos together. Okay, and this is many years before matthew mcconaughey would do that naked.
Speaker 2:Oh, that's right, remember that story. He was caught one time. I know. Yeah, you know that.
Speaker 5:Of course he's the ambassador in Austin Texas. He's the cultural ambassador, oh boy.
Speaker 1:It took Hackman seven years to get his first paid acting gig, and that was in Chaparral off broadway in 1958. This play. Eventually, faye and gene decided to kick dusty out of their apartment. Hey, get out of here.
Speaker 5:They remained friends. That's good, because I know a lot of these actor types who just mooch and mooch and mooch and they're like what do you mean?
Speaker 1:I gotta go.
Speaker 5:It's only been seven years it's like no go, good go, yeah, figure it out. It is amazing the idea that Dustin Hoffman was just like shooed out like Nermal the cat, yeah, like we're sending you to Abu Dhabi, yeah, at some point you got to get out of our kitchen.
Speaker 1:Of course, at some point they have to cook.
Speaker 5:Right, you back what you what? You're cooking.
Speaker 1:Oh, can I be table again he wouldn't do those weird acting exercises, probably get out of here.
Speaker 6:Well, he's probably prepping for tootsie. He's got caught wearing dresses around the house.
Speaker 5:Oh yeah, gotta go it's so funny because my older brother does drag and I remember watching tootsie with my father and my brothers, and after the movie my dad loved it, by the way, but afterwards he's like just so you know it, not right. It's not right for a man to wear a dress, oh my God. But my God, with two gay older brothers later, I'm the straight one.
Speaker 1:Many, many years later, dusty and Hackman would appear together in the movie Runaway Jury. Oh, and that was their only time together on screen. Wow, and that was their only time together on screen.
Speaker 5:Wow, in a 2004 Vanity Fair article Hackman said that he had a terrible memory of working as a doorman at the Chrysler building. I could not see him being a comforting person when it comes to like welcome, welcome, and he just looks like an ashtray. Yeah, I don't feel like the love, welcome in, he just looks like an ashtray. Yeah, I don't feel like the love.
Speaker 1:And so one of the people that he was in the Marines with a former officer passed by him one day and he had to open the door for him. And then the officer said Hackman, you're a sorry son of a bitch.
Speaker 5:Oh man.
Speaker 1:Hackman's just getting piled up, I know, like first the Pasadena Playhouse, then this Marine officer.
Speaker 6:First his dad leaves. He's like see you later, loser Right. Then everyone else is just being just as mean. Is everyone friends with his dad?
Speaker 5:Dustin Hoffman's in there eating all the bologna. When he comes home, there's nothing. Yes, hey. Well, you can have a bread sandwich, can't you?
Speaker 6:yeah, I live here.
Speaker 1:You live in my kitchen okay, so the story continues to be tragic, I'm sorry to say. Oh boy, in 1962 hackman's mom died after she got so drunk that she passed out with a lit cigarette in her hand.
Speaker 5:One out of four people before 1980 died this way yeah.
Speaker 1:And the house went ablaze, oh my God, and so did she.
Speaker 5:Wow, I mean died. It's so cliche, but doing what she loved to do yeah, getting hammered, smoking a cig.
Speaker 1:Passing out.
Speaker 1:Passing out. It was around this time that Hackman moved back to California, specifically Hollywood, to finally once and for all pursue movie roles, and his mom would never get to see him actually act. Oh, that's too bad, wow. Even though that one comment made a profound impact on his life, I believe it. Here's a bit of trivia. Hackman turned down the lead role of the Graduate, which went to his bestie, dusty Interesting, and instead his big break was in Bonnie and Clyde in 1967. He played Clyde's brother Buck, who was an accomplice in the bank robberies.
Speaker 5:Okay, well, that definitely would have been a different movie. The Graduate with Gene.
Speaker 1:Hackman oh for sure, yeah, I think it worked out. And the weird part is both of them look like they were 45 years old at that time.
Speaker 3:Right.
Speaker 1:But, he's supposed to be a Dohiat College student.
Speaker 5:It's been a long four years.
Speaker 1:Bonnie and Clyde was a cultural phenomenon that really kicked off the new Hollywood. That bled into the 1970s. You know, easy rider was a little bit later, but bonnie and clyde I mean, if you can just imagine it. Audiences are used to movies like the sound of music and the haze code, where you can't swear, you can't show nudity and in every movie.
Speaker 5:Every movie has to have a nazi narrative.
Speaker 1:Yeah, exactly yeah, carrie grant going to war and fighting for the states. Well, bonnie and clyde, I mean, there's like sexual innuendo, it's violent, there's a lot of swearing, it's just a. It's like a modern movie, yeah, but it was the first of its kind. Hackman was definitely noticed. He got his first oscar nomination for supporting actor.
Speaker 5:Damn also, if you want to see the bonnie and clyde car, it's at buffalo bill's casino. Oh shit, yes, indeed, right on the way to vegas. Right on the way to vegas. I stayed there a couple of times. Not a good place, yeah, but uh interesting good old prim nevada. In prim I won big on the pick six.
Speaker 1:Nice Congratulations.
Speaker 5:No problem.
Speaker 1:Thanks. So of all the movies that he wished his mom could have seen, he says that it's I Never Sang for my Father, which was released in 1970, because he said it was a sensitive portrayal about family and relationships. Yeah, I would imagine. It's about a college professor who has a difficult relationship with his dad in the wake of his mom's death.
Speaker 5:And perhaps we'll touch on it, but does he ever re-night with his dad? He?
Speaker 1:did, and he actually said that he didn't have any bitterness None at all. He must have worked on that and that he loved his dad to the end. But of course one never forgets yeah, you were abandoned by him, right? So I don't think that they were that close, especially when a boy needs his father. Yeah, but he did take the high road, that's good and incidentally, that role in I never sang for my father earned him a second oscar nomination for best supporting actor so he really went from zero to a hundred, very exactly wow yeah, least likely to succeed.
Speaker 1:By the way, remember that, yeah, they're never right, they're just jealous of your talent and he would not actually win an Oscar until a couple years later, with the French Connection, released in 1971, directed by one of our favorites, William Friedkin. Yes, and that's about a pair of detectives who and there's this heroin smuggling ring and they're trying to stop the bad guy. You know, yeah, classic, good versus evil yeah, a bad guy.
Speaker 6:You know, yeah, classic good versus evil. Yeah, a lot of tire screeching, yeah.
Speaker 5:And for those wondering, I have no idea who that guy is. Who William Friedkin?
Speaker 6:Director of the.
Speaker 5:Exorcist. Oh, I love him, yeah Great.
Speaker 6:I don't know names. He's done like so many different types of movies.
Speaker 1:He has a very weird, uh imdb list, yeah, interesting, and we've touched on him on the podcast before because we've talked about we had an episode on the exorcist, yeah, and he's just an interesting guy. He didn't take no guff, he didn't take any guff whatsoever yeah who was he talking about?
Speaker 6:al pacino and he goes I don't give a roll a flying fuck through a rolling donut. What al pacino thinks of my films that's amazing.
Speaker 1:They didn't get along on the set of Cruising. Oh, that's a great horror film?
Speaker 5:Sure is yeah.
Speaker 1:I used to have a t-shirt.
Speaker 6:Oh my God, it's just low-cut.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's just low-cut leather.
Speaker 5:Hey man, I don't mess with them. Nope, there's a bar near us called the Bullet.
Speaker 1:You know, those gay bars just sound very, very aggressive. Yeah, like jackhammer. Yeah, catch a bullet. So french connection is famous for that driving sequence where william friedkin almost died holding a camera on top of a car to get the shot for the big chase. Cool, and it's an amazing sequence. If you watch it, you're never going to see that with cgi today and they never blocked off the street.
Speaker 6:So they were really like, yeah, is that right?
Speaker 5:oh my god, yeah, just imagine being on your way to work and you're just like so the guy did the exorcist what's happening?
Speaker 3:gene hackman, what?
Speaker 1:and gene hackman, of course, played jimmy popeye doyle, the detective, and that is named after the, the cartoon character, because the character is based on real life detective Eddie Egan, and apparently he would flex his muscles after catching a criminal.
Speaker 5:He gave it five booms. Yeah, Boom boom, boom, boom, boom. You got to do it. I mean, that's the problem with the boom guys. Yeah. What was the worst part about getting arrested for armed robbery? He gave me five booms.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I got five booms.
Speaker 1:Let's watch a clip from the French Connection. And one thing about this clip if you wanna play a drinking game, take a sip every time you hear the word Poughkeepsie.
Speaker 3:Okay, you ever been to Poughkeepsie? Huh, have you ever been to Poughkeepsie? Hey man, come on, give me a break, hey, Aaron what you talking about? Let me hear you say it Come on. Have you ever been to Poughkeepsie? You've been to Poughkeepsie, haven't you? I want to hear it Come on. Yes, yes, yes, you've been All right.
Speaker 5:I just drank my seven sips of coffee.
Speaker 1:I'm wired after that. So Hackman did win the Oscar for best leading actor.
Speaker 5:There we go, finally he got it, but he's always in the running, he's always in the mix.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and it also won best picture Nice, and this kicked off a very prolific career. He averaged about two movies a year. That sounds about right. Yeah, because when we grew up there was always a gene hackman movie somewhere. Right, absolutely his personal favorite movie that he worked on is called scarecrow uh, it's not welcome to moose port which he starred with Al Pacino.
Speaker 5:Yeah, also, isn't he one? Gene Hackman is one of those guys that's always been old right. Yeah, we've never seen him young Right and he did, even though he's not that really. He's really not that old in these movies. No.
Speaker 1:He did start off kind of old though, because it took him a while to get going Right, him a while to get going right. So he wasn't like a young buck, even though he did play young buck. But yeah, scarecrow apparently was a huge box office disappointment and it turned him off from doing other art films like it scarred him. That's why he did so many commercial movies after that and he would second guess taking roles in other movies like Jaws Cuckoo's Nest Raiders of the Lost Ark. He turned down those roles and Silence of the Lambs.
Speaker 5:Whoa.
Speaker 1:What was he going to be in Silence of the Lambs? Hannibal Lecter Wow, that would have been awesome too.
Speaker 2:I think it wouldn't have been bad. Not as good, I don't think because the role was made for.
Speaker 5:Anthony Hopkins. I can see Gene Hackman with the Billy Club slamming it into the head of the officer. I could see that, though there are definitely moments in that movie that Gene Hackman would do great in.
Speaker 1:But he later did reflect and say that he loves the flop Scarecrow without Pacino. So we got to watch that sometime, I think Going to scare some crows.
Speaker 3:Going to get these crows off me, scare crows got a big ass.
Speaker 5:All I think is Dunkachinos. That's not even real. It's a parody and I hate it for helping people.
Speaker 6:I love it. Jack and Jill reference Jack and Jill. I've never seen it. It's Alejandro's favorite movie.
Speaker 1:I've been trying to get Kyle to watch the Love Guru and Jack and Jill forever.
Speaker 5:We can all sit down and watch it. I'll light a fire and you know, we can throw ourselves into it afterwards. Yeah, exactly, let's do it.
Speaker 1:And why don't we take a look at this interview from 1976 with this surly British guy who is not so subtle about what he thinks about Hackman's appeal as a leading man?
Speaker 3:Wow, not so subtle about what he thinks about hackman's appeal as a leading man. Wow, do you ever wonder why it should have happened to you? Um, because you're not really in the kind of pretty mold of robert redford in the superstar, are you, did you?
Speaker 1:think I don't know, I thought I was. Perhaps you're not quite as pretty as robert redford, oh my god, do you think that the average american identifies with you more than he does with with redford or mQueen I have no idea.
Speaker 4:I ask myself that every morning when I shave what are you doing in this business? You know You're on a pass. Go steal the money before they finally take a good hard look at you?
Speaker 3:I don't know. That's really a mystery to me. That's really a mystery and I'm afraid if I examine it too closely it'll really start frightening me.
Speaker 5:What if I grab your ankles and wave you like the old American flag? Yeah, you bastard, what are you talking about? He's a handsome man. He's rugged.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, and I actually can refute that, because my mom once told me that she had a crush on Gene Hackman A lot of women did Wow.
Speaker 5:That's when women did Wow. That's when women liked Strong Surely boy.
Speaker 1:Yeah, she said he was dashing. Ooh, after the French connection. Success isn't even the word right, it goes to the stratosphere. Then he does the Poseidon Adventure, which was another huge hit. And so for his next movie he received over a million dollars. It was called Lucky Lady and that flopped like the scarecrow. But he was cemented as a leading man in Hollywood. There you go. And in 1972, he made Nixon's List of Enemies. How about that?
Speaker 5:That's awesome. That's the list you want to be on. Bring him in here. I hate talking to Gene Hackman. Is he a Jew? No word if he's Jewish.
Speaker 1:Call him a Jew. Are you a crook? So Hackman usually stayed out of politics but apparently he was a lifelong Democrat, but I think, moderate because he loved Reagan.
Speaker 5:Well, the party has changed quite a bit. Yeah right, Can't wait for them to get back.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and then I mean so many classics in the 70s alone the Conversation, the Coppola movie and Superman.
Speaker 5:Yeah, that's where I know him from. Now we're talking my speed, okay.
Speaker 1:We got a clip of him as Lex Luthor Evil Super. Was he a genius? He's a genius. Just the most evil super genius of all time he's up there.
Speaker 3:Everything west of this line is the richest, most expensive real estate in the world San Diego, Los Angeles, San Francisco, Everything on this side of the line is just hundreds and hundreds of miles of worthless desert land, which just so happens to be owned by Alex Luthor Incorporated. Now, call me foolish, call me irresponsible. It occurs to me that a 500 megaton bomb planted at just the proper point would destroy most of California, the West Coast as we know. It would fall into the sea. Bye-bye California. Hello new West Coast, my West Coast.
Speaker 5:Wow, I think that just happened, interesting.
Speaker 1:Yeah, very timely. So he also appeared in Superman 2, but then that one, famously Richard Donner, had a falling out with Warner Brothers and he was kicked off that and this pissed off Gene Hackman, so he refused to appear in Superman 3.
Speaker 5:Which one did Superman have his hair holding up that big old ball?
Speaker 1:I remember that he had a strand of pubic hair and it was holding up like a 10 000 pound ball it was probably the third one, because that's where it got like really wacky yeah with richard pryor yeah, it's in a museum, yeah, but then the canon group took over the franchise and offered hackman a ton of money to appear in superman 4, the quest for peace, which is the worst superhero movie ever made.
Speaker 6:Oh my god that says a lot too yeah, even worse than like the original green.
Speaker 5:Uh, what was it? Uh, oh my god, the green lantern with ryan. Even worse than that, I it's a tie.
Speaker 1:Okay put it this Plan 9 from Outer Space is a better movie than Superman 4. There you go. And yeah, it was a major financial flop. Or, excuse me, canon was going through a lot of financial troubles and so they had to cut the budget. That's why it's so cheap looking yeah.
Speaker 5:It's a bird, it's a plane, it's a guy on strings that we can notably see Exactly.
Speaker 1:It's a bird, it's a plane, it's a guy on strings that we can notably see Exactly, it's stuff like that. Then he follows that up with Hoosiers.
Speaker 5:I remember Hoosiers yeah, we had to watch that in seventh grade. Learn the game of basketball, baby. Learn the game of passion.
Speaker 1:Yep, dennis Hopper also great in that. Dennis Hopper fantastic in that. So Dennis Hopper fantastic in that. So, with that career high, there's also a low, a personal low, because he and Faye get divorced. He broke up with the Maltese Mm-hmm After 30 years of marriage. The Falcon flew Wow 30 years. Yeah, and then we got Mississippi Burnin'. Oh, that's a hard one to watch Very important movie I know it's the white savior thing, but is he not amazing in that?
Speaker 5:yeah, it was also. I mean, for the time that was a very important film, oh for sure, yeah, I've just heard some criticism about it by spike lee it's not the well you spike, lee will criticize and I'm not going to sit here and say that you shouldn't.
Speaker 5:But it's not the blind side, that's a white savior and that's why that man, what is it? Or? Or he's suing that family. They're fucking scumbags. The blind side makes my skin crawl they'll be like I can't believe that white woman is in the black area and it's like, yeah, people live there, yeah you can survive taking a walk if you want is that the one she won the oscar for oh, yeah, oh that movie is such trash, it's garbage.
Speaker 5:They had that little white kid trying to. They pretend like he taught this guy how to play football.
Speaker 1:I can't, I'm not if the academy had any credibility left, it was gone with that one absolutely who are those people, but we'll talk about that later yeah, I mean, he did so many movies.
Speaker 1:Narrow margin is another underrated one from 1990, a great thriller. But again, you know, his career highs are also marked with personal lows, because he had a heart attack in 1990. I heard a tick. Yeah, geez, he was, uh, you know hacking, I guess there go. He had chest pains, right, and I guess he had a balloon-sized catheter inserted into one of his arteries, yeah, to pump it up, which had become dangerously narrow, like the margin in that thriller movie. Hey, Starring at the time.
Speaker 5:Yeah, I think I blame the name of the movie.
Speaker 1:Narrow margin what?
Speaker 2:are they asking it's the most boring name I have.
Speaker 5:It's a narrow margin. What is the most boring name I have? It's a narrow margin. Yeah, it sounds like shit. Yeah, what am I talking? What did we talk? What is it about?
Speaker 1:maybe the universe was just trying to warn him. Yeah, oh could be narrow artery hey, it is a good movie though. So he underwent successful angioplasty surgery and that was that all the problem. I mean, he lasted a long time after that it's 1990, right 1991? 1990. Yep, okay, 1991,. He got married again oh, that's good for the heart To a woman named Betsy Arakawa, a classical pianist and businesswoman from Hawaii.
Speaker 6:Nice. Yeah, I just had a heart attack.
Speaker 1:let me relax by getting married whoa kyle telling the truth floof maybe he got a look at that prenup and had the heart attack. You never know. Uh, they met each other at a gym in california and then they built a quiet life together in New Mexico. What could go wrong? Nothing, not in New Mexico. And they constructed their dream home with the help of architect friends, and it was even featured on MTV Cribs. It was Whoa no.
Speaker 5:I was going to say I cannot imagine Gene. Hackman coming in with the black light and be like where's your semen?
Speaker 1:Yo, he's with the main man, Gene Hackman. It was featured in Architectural Digest. Oh slightly different and I have a little excerpt from that describing the estate.
Speaker 6:Nice Say this is where the magic happens.
Speaker 1:Yes, kyle, actually, if you will. Okay, this is directly from the article describing this dream home yeah, we are not messing around here and I have to ask is this you again?
Speaker 5:yeah, did you write this article?
Speaker 6:he was four years old writing this, okay yeah, I started gaga gene hackman nice house.
Speaker 1:I started out at architecturalest and moved on to the Badger Herald.
Speaker 6:Yes, Quote his newest house is on 12 acres of pinon-covered hilltop, a few miles north of Santa Fe, with a 360-degree view that stretches as far as the mountains of Colorado. Oh, he was attracted to Santa Fe after working on a couple of movies there. Quote, it had a kind of magic in it there, quote, it had a kind of magic in it. Uh the quote. The house is described as, quote, a blend of styles part pueblo, part colonial new mexico, part spanish baroque. Uh, more primitive, like a barn converted into a house, massive and cozy at the same time oh, I love massive and cozy.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's like me, so can y'all feel this? Yes this is where he is settling it's sanctuary yes, I can smoke that cigar.
Speaker 5:Right now it's hanging out new mexico, beautiful mountains, cozy couch yeah I'm thinking a lot of tan and taupe oh yeah, but he continues working in hollywood.
Speaker 6:In 1992 he wins another oscar, whoa guy cannot be denied for unforgiven.
Speaker 1:The revisionist western from clint eastwood. Wait, is it?
Speaker 5:revisionist. That's my truth.
Speaker 1:Unforgiven documentary yes, and hackman played ruthless sheriff little bill daggart, and that was kind of the start of clint's renaissance, I would say, because before that he had directed some movies but he wasn't known as a great director I think this cemented that. Oh yeah, I mean think about it then he goes on to do later on mystic river. That's right. Million dollar, baby, is that it?
Speaker 5:no, there was the, uh, the one that he did richard jewel, that was pretty good. Yeah, that was, was the one that he did Richard Jewell.
Speaker 1:that was pretty good.
Speaker 5:Oh yeah.
Speaker 6:I forgot that was him.
Speaker 5:The one where he's an older fella and he works with a lot of Hmong actors. Graham Torino, yes, graham Torino.
Speaker 1:Get off my lawn. I thought that was pretty good. Oh yeah, he's a great filmmaker let's just say that.
Speaker 5:And everyone knows, when I'm old I'm going to say get on my lawn lawn.
Speaker 1:Really freak him out. Come on, hang out with me, sit on my lap. Come on, get on my lawn. The gang is like we don't know what to do. Yeah, hang out. So, yeah, I'm forgiven is what you get when you mix two greats, am I right? Yes, and then he followed that up with listen to these titles, get shorty. Oh, so fun. We mentioned crimson tide, which was a phenomenal hit and a raw movie, because on set he accidentally punched denzel washington for real. Is that right?
Speaker 5:uh-huh and crimson tide also just a fantastic coming-of-age film about a woman who gets her period.
Speaker 6:I liked it, thank you, that's why I get paid very few dollars to be here.
Speaker 5:Feel free to give to our Patreon, patreoncom slash diebug.
Speaker 1:I thought about it on the way home and it hit me. So we've heard him play a badass cop and a badass bad guy, but have we heard him do comedy? Not yet Okay. So we have a clip here from the birdcage Hello, comedy not yet okay. So we have a clip here from the birdcage hello. In this scene he is meeting the parents of his future son-in-law. Got you and he's ducking a scandal because he's a conservative senator and his fellow conservative senator and friend has dropped dead and he was found dead with a hooker oh, mama, so mama.
Speaker 1:So that tension is building as he's meeting. Nathan Lane and Robin Williams Love it.
Speaker 3:You know, I think homosexuality Lots more ice for you, lots more ice, dad, one of the things that's weakening this country Really. You know, that's what I thought until I found out.
Speaker 6:Alexander the Great was a fag Talk about gays in the military.
Speaker 2:Not like those dolphins, huh.
Speaker 4:I think we're skirting an issue here that has Mr Coleman very nervous. I know you've heard the terrible news about Senator Jackson, how he died, oh that.
Speaker 2:Yes, what an ugly story.
Speaker 3:Of course we don't believe a word of it.
Speaker 5:What do you mean? He was obviously framed, and I for one would like an autopsy.
Speaker 3:That's just what Rush Limbaugh said.
Speaker 5:That's amazing.
Speaker 1:So yeah.
Speaker 5:I mean, come on, it's also fantastic timing. He's just a great actor. And then Get Shorty was sarcastic, right, I guess not a comedy, but it was a satire.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it was a dark comedy.
Speaker 5:Yes.
Speaker 1:He did a voice in Ants. So he also did a little cartoon voiceover work.
Speaker 6:That was the big computer-generated cartoon rush of the late 90s.
Speaker 5:Right, we got some good stuff back then. Yeah, we were all right.
Speaker 6:Bugs Life Toy Story. They were all going for it.
Speaker 1:What was the bug?
Speaker 5:rush. It sounds like.
Speaker 6:Yeah, exactly yeah.
Speaker 5:There's a lot behind Toy Story, a lot of intertwining things with Pixar. Ooh, watched a whole YouTube video on it.
Speaker 1:And, incidentally, ants was a bit of a reunion between him and Woody Allen. Oh, because Woody Allen plays the main Ant and they work together on a movie called Another Woman in the 80s, which is an excellent movie, by the way.
Speaker 5:Okay, we're not going to get into Woody Allen.
Speaker 1:Can I just mention, woody Allen gets into people.
Speaker 6:They work together. Oh too soon-y Jeez.
Speaker 5:Oh boy, oh nice.
Speaker 1:Man Too soon-y Jesus, nice man, all right.
Speaker 5:Anyway, boom, patreoncom slash skybud.
Speaker 1:Come on now. No.
Speaker 5:Let the man live. Let the man live.
Speaker 1:The remember how I mentioned that he did about two a year. Yes, well, in 2001, he did five movies. Ooh Damn, the Mexican Heartbreakers Heist Behind and Behind Enemy Lines and the Royal Tenenbaums.
Speaker 6:Those were all amazing films so good, the Royal Tenenbaums, one of my favorite of all time.
Speaker 5:Behind Enemy Lines. Yeah, that was a good one too.
Speaker 6:It's a thriller Heartbreakers was good too. Yeah, with Susan Sarandon, I believe, being the uh, the older person. That's uh scamming and yes jennifer love hewitt jennifer love hewitt.
Speaker 1:Oh my god, yeah, looks ravishing in it her and sigourney weaver oh sigourney weaver. That's what it was. Yes, love it. Heist is a david mammoth movie, by the way. Oh, and that's has the famous line given by danny devito where he says that's why they call it money. Oh, and nobody has any idea what that means oh god okay, good, and when you think about the royal tenenbaums, that must have been a very powerful experience, because he was playing an awful father.
Speaker 5:Yeah, yeah, it all comes together.
Speaker 1:Also in 2001,. There was a tragedy that occurred.
Speaker 5:Are we going to mention it? Yeah, go ahead, ben Well, the New York Knicks didn't get out of round one. Yeah, we really thought with Larry. Johnson. We had a chance at the finals.
Speaker 6:Yeah.
Speaker 5:Kyle.
Speaker 6:Britney Spears or Mariah Carey released glitter.
Speaker 1:No, hackman was involved in a road rage incident. Oh Two men, he took down two towers in a road rage incident. Two men who towered over him attacked him after hitting their cars collided in Hollywood. Oh my goodness, so geez. Can a man just relax in this town?
Speaker 5:I will say Los Angeles needs to like chill on the road. Oh for sure, so much road rage. That's why I just drive forward, because you'll get shot. You'll get shot.
Speaker 1:Yeah, in 2003,. That is when he appeared with Dustin Hoffman for the one and only time in Runaway Jury, which was his third John Grisham movie. Before that he had done the Firm and the Chamber. And that same year he made a rare appearance with wife Betsy on the red carpet at the Golden Globes because they were awarding him the cecil b demille lifetime achievement award mr demille, I'm not dead yet.
Speaker 5:Well, you know that when you get the lifetime achievement award, it's like all right, pal, wrap it up.
Speaker 1:Wrap it up, clock is ticking sure, but they tend to give it to people when they're still sort of have have some life in them, right, so they can enjoy it. You don't want to see a bag of bones in the seat, do you?
Speaker 5:well, ask calista flockhart hey, just again.
Speaker 1:Wow, what a day. And that would be their last red carpet appearance together. Wow, this was 20 years ago, yeah, longer that. And then the next year, in 2004,. He starred in the movie Welcome to Mooseport hey, with Ray Romano and, if you can believe it, ben, yeah, that was his final appearance on the silver screen, his swan song it's Welcome to Mooseport.
Speaker 5:Uh-huh Out of all the great things he's done. Yeah, with Ray Romano.
Speaker 1:Oh my God, it's an things he's done. Yeah, with ray romano. Oh my god. In an interview with larry king that year he hinted at his retirement. It really wasn't much of a hint, actually.
Speaker 5:All right fuck you, fuck you, you're cool, I'm out, yeah I don't have a project, larry, if you have a script.
Speaker 3:I'll read it. Nothing's on, there's no script in front of you.
Speaker 4:No one's calling Gene Hackman. No, it's probably all over Whoa, so this is like the clear ending on Larry King Live Right. What about another book? We're working on a Civil War story Again in the back, yeah, back history, back history About 200 pages into that. You Back history About 200 pages into that. You keep going back. Yeah, maybe I'll catch up, I don't know.
Speaker 3:What do you think you would have done if you didn't do this?
Speaker 4:You know I did a lot of things. I sold shoes, I drove a truck, I drove a cab, I jerked sodas.
Speaker 5:Jerk sodas, I don't know what profession, I don't know no-transcript. Can you imagine him knocking on your door? You want life insurance. You just soda jerked. I'm going to take my life Interesting. So he doesn't seem like he is thrilled with the idea of retirement, though, or maybe that's just his personality, maybe Because he's just like it's over.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, actually, I kind of have the answer to that, okay, but before that, you notice how he mentioned writing. Well, he met this guy, daniel Lenihan, on the set of the Firm because there's a scuba diving scene, yeah, and this guy was like a trainer, an expert, and what do you call one of the like a marineologist?
Speaker 6:What Marine?
Speaker 5:biologist. You're looking at the wrong guy. A trainer Undersea.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, marine biologist. Oh oh, he's an undersea archaeologist. There we go. I had it right in my yeah just read the.
Speaker 1:Thing so they hit it off on the set of the firm and they wrote a bunch of books together. Their first one was wake of the perdido star in 1999 it's a great one and and then Justice for None in 2004, which he mentioned in the Larry King interview, and they wrote a couple more. And then Hackman wrote a couple more on his own, the last one being published in 2013. And it was a police thriller. Cool yeah, so that's what he was doing with his time when not acting.
Speaker 5:And he was. Was he writing the bulk of the books? Was he actually sitting down and tangibly writing them, or was it more like a partnership?
Speaker 1:It was a partnership. He wrote his parts in longhand, which sounds awful it hurts. And when the books were released they sold pretty well but got bad reviews.
Speaker 5:Well, if they're selling, who cares? Yeah?
Speaker 1:yeah, exactly, I mean that if you had to pick one, right? Yeah, yeah, sure, whatever. So after welcome to mooseport, hackman only appeared as a voiceover for lowe's home and garden stores in their commercials, that's the dream right there he officially announced his retirement in 2008 and he didn't really do that many interviews and rarely talked about his personal life after that and usually on the junkets he kept it very surface. One appearance he made is pretty interesting to me. He had a run-in with guy fieri and he took a trip down to Flavortown.
Speaker 5:Whoa Wow, this is the biggest credit yet.
Speaker 1:In a popular Santa Fe diner and I tracked down that clip. Uh-oh, I can't believe it.
Speaker 5:Also. Thank you for pronouncing. Guy Fiete Fieri Did.
Speaker 1:I say it right?
Speaker 3:Yes, great, I mean that's Fieri, but with respect, when you say with respect, it's Fieri Today while we're in Santa Fe, new Mexico, on the I-25 at Harry's Roadhouse.
Speaker 5:It's always good and it's always a pleasant place to be.
Speaker 3:Hi guys, we're all sorts of folks from all around Santa Fe Kind of a staple, even Oscar-winning actor Gene Hackman, and nobody pays the attention. You know, just gotta cruise in.
Speaker 5:Yeah, until we come dragging our cameras across the table. We come dragging our cameras across your table.
Speaker 3:What makes the Roadhouse, one of your go-to spots, you know I can come in any way I want to. I mean, compared to you look pretty good, except your hair.
Speaker 6:What do you think about me Except?
Speaker 5:your hair. That's awesome. Imagine that being your diner you go to. You're like yeah, there's Gene, so cool, oh Gene.
Speaker 1:I took a shot with Guy Fieri last year. Yeah, you did At an Emmy event. You did yeah because I was in the front row and so he offered us shots. What? Yeah, I cheers with him and everything. It was a very cool moment.
Speaker 2:That's awesome.
Speaker 1:You know, we always talk about the brush with greatness, like with David Lynch and. Jerry Springer. Well, guy Fieri is one of those.
Speaker 5:I didn't know you were so connected in Hollywood.
Speaker 1:Yeah, me and Hackman. We know Fieri Been to.
Speaker 6:Flavortown.
Speaker 1:Some other hobbies he had besides riding and going to diners. He competed as a race car driver In the late 70s. He was I don't know. He drove in a Daytona race once. That's big. He won the Long Beach Grand Prix Celebrity Race as well, so that's pretty cool. He also loved biking. But then tragedy follows this guy because Well, life is tragic. In 2012, he was struck by a pickup truck while cycling in the florida keys, and reports said that he suffered serious head trauma, but then his publicist said it was merely bumps and bruises on his brain wow, and I mean at this point, he's getting up there in age.
Speaker 1:You don't want to be hit by a truck yeah and he fades into the sunset after that, because his last book was 2013 and people aren't hearing from him that often.
Speaker 6:In 2020, closer magazine did a profile on his whereabouts these days, gene, who turned 90 on january 30th, leads a stress-free life in santa fe, new mexico, with betsy, his wife, since 1991. His health is good, he still bicycles, does yard work and he's a great handyman. An insider exclusively tells closer weekly quote after all the drama of gene's career, he loves the peaceful life he shares with the lovely Betsy.
Speaker 1:Oh nice, I like that. In an earlier interview with GQ magazine see that I know, Gentleman quarterly Uh-huh he lamented the fact that success took him away from his family. Quote I lost touch with my son in terms of advice early on. I was doing location films when he was at an age when he needed support and guidance, so that's kind of interesting.
Speaker 5:No wonder, like father, like son, oh boy. Probably had some guilt. Of course, he's much better than his father because he was around. Yeah, he was just working.
Speaker 1:According to insider reports, Hackman reconciled with his kids in his later years and when asked about his legacy in that same GQ interview, he said he'd like to be remembered as a decent actor, as someone who tried to portray what was given to him in an honest fashion.
Speaker 5:Very humble. He was beyond decent.
Speaker 1:And I think we should hear one other snippet from that Larry King interview.
Speaker 2:What do you fear?
Speaker 3:Do you worry about your health?
Speaker 4:I try to take care of myself. I don't have a lot of fears. I have the normal fear of passing away. I guess we all think about that, especially you get to be a certain age. I want to make sure that my wife and my family are taken care of. Other than that, I don't have a lot of fear.
Speaker 3:A few other things. Where were you on 9-11?
Speaker 5:Oh wait, wait, Hold on, hold on a second. Is Larry making my point?
Speaker 2:Were you driving 9-11? Were you?
Speaker 5:driving in your car.
Speaker 2:Oh.
Speaker 5:Larry, just what a non sequitur. How do you want to be remembered? Where were you on 9-11? What the fuck? What happened?
Speaker 1:Oh, Larry Classic King, Now you chose to retire. Right, that was your decision. You're unemployed correct. So why?
Speaker 5:were you pro 9-11? Interesting though, he was talking about his wife being taken care of, as of course we know now.
Speaker 1:Yes, yes, she got taken care of all right. Whoa, whoa hey.
Speaker 6:Wow, wow. Alejandro Sounds like it has mob ties there. We're getting there folks. She was dealt with.
Speaker 1:Alejandro says March 2024, the New York Post finds the Hackmans. Oh wait, it was the New York Post that found them. Yeah, if you want to open that article link there, kyle, these are the paparazzi photos that were snapped at that time. Wow. And people were shocked, yes, at his gaunt appearance.
Speaker 5:The only time I saw him was brief paparazzi footage and he was so yeah, he's tiny. Well, yeah, he's 95. I know he's 95, so that's good.
Speaker 1:He looks like Christian Bale's character from the Machinist as a grandpa.
Speaker 5:Yeah, but again he's old.
Speaker 1:Yeah. So he and wife Betsy were spotted dining at Papa Doe's Seafood Kitchen, and earlier that day he was seen grabbing a cup of coffee and apple pie from a Speedway store. I love that. Staying true to himself, he was using a cane and holding onto Betsy's arm for support.
Speaker 5:He's damn near a hundred years old, yeah.
Speaker 6:He earned it.
Speaker 1:And I think that is where their story kind of ends.
Speaker 6:But this episode just begins, oh, thank God, all that to say this. Gene hackman's dead. And it was so weird because we all woke up and then everyone's looking on twitter and stuff. This happened in the middle of the night. I was actually, you know, putting together our last episode with jerry springer and at like two in the morning it started. My phone beeps and it's like hey, gene Hackman was just found dead and the police said that it was not suspicious when they first came up with it.
Speaker 5:Well, carbon monoxide came in to the conversation very quickly.
Speaker 6:Very quickly. Yeah, because you have Gene Hackman dead, they have his wife dead and one of the dogs was dead. You just automatically assume somebody messed up, there was a leak somewhere right, that's what happened to weird al yankovic's parents oh, that's right together carbon monoxide.
Speaker 6:So it does happen yeah, and then within a day or two, there was all these headlines that say police do u-turn on death theory. Right, because the gas company went in there and the fire department went in there and they said there is zero carbon monoxide leak anywhere on the property. It's a mystery, yeah. What they did find what it's come out now is that his wife was surrounded by pills, yes, and the dog possibly could have gotten into those as well oh wow.
Speaker 5:Well, I know pills and dogs and they don't like them. So I don't know, because it's a bastard to get your dog to eat any kind of pill.
Speaker 6:That's true too. You've got to put it in treats.
Speaker 5:You've got to mix it in everything.
Speaker 6:That's a great point You've got to trick them.
Speaker 5:So would the dog just go lap up a bunch of pills? These are my favorite. Have I told I'm a total heroin addict dog?
Speaker 1:It was that brand of begging pills, yeah.
Speaker 6:It's not like bacon.
Speaker 1:Wait, one other thing. Wasn't the dog found in a closet?
Speaker 6:They said that there's no evidence of that right now. Oh, really. Yes, All we know is that he was in the house and the other two were outside the house. That survived.
Speaker 5:And the wife Betsy. She was in the tub. She wasn't in the tub.
Speaker 6:She was in the tub. She wasn't in the tub, she was on the ground. Okay, where?
Speaker 5:in the living room. They were saying they were very close together okay, her and gene, gene, okay, yeah, and dustin hoffman was lying on the kitchen floor.
Speaker 6:He was like I'm ready for dinner, put it on my back and, ironically, the other two were the dusty ones. Yes, they were rolling around, I got it. They got dust bunnies on. They're on the floor, yes, yeah. So what we were told is very easy Put a bow on it, they're gone. Then it comes out Definitely not monoxide poisoning. And now it's labeled as suspicious.
Speaker 1:And that's interesting the way you put it where you happen to be up late. Yes, getting it in real time. Well, it was weird. When I woke up, and it was pretty early, it was still like 7 am. Yeah, it felt like it was old news, right. Suddenly I saw a ton of articles like we now suspect something else other than carbon monoxide. I'm like how long has this story been around?
Speaker 6:right, so it was february 28th. No what, what was the actual date?
Speaker 1:when they were found? Yes, I believe. So it must have been wednesday, right, I think it was wednesday, the. I mean it must have been late february. Friday was the 28th, thursday was? I think it was wednesday the 26th. Yeah, when they were found, correct?
Speaker 6:yes, because, uh, what they had come out and said is after everything was that, oh my god. We looked at his pacemaker data and he had died nine days before he had been found so that means bugs are involved.
Speaker 5:Well, they said ants.
Speaker 6:This is the quote that every news article uses.
Speaker 1:Both bodies were mummified wow, and then they found him dead, yes, and then they died.
Speaker 5:Yeah, that's brutal. Uh, it's also a very new york death. Yeah, new york deaths are when you die and then a month later someone knocks on your door and then they find you yeah, because you got stuff leaking through your ceiling like, hey, what's that?
Speaker 6:oh, that's the person's body, great, liquefied.
Speaker 1:But this is and a very classic hollywood hills death. Yeah, because what was the name of that actress that turned into the carpet like she melted into the floor?
Speaker 6:I forget who it was, but I know what you're talking.
Speaker 1:The pictures are still in my brain damn, you know it's sad like, but it can like old stars just yeah.
Speaker 6:Yeah, so the whole weirdness of it is they were mummified, you would think, like they're in New Mexico, it's going to be hot there and they're just going to be, you know, just liquefied. But they were completely intact and well preserved. It's been like between 30 and 50 degrees there, so I think it's just cold enough to keep them preserved a little bit and kept together. Well, I guess they have heat on in the house.
Speaker 1:Well, maybe not that time and, interestingly enough, larry King wanted to be frozen when he died. No, joke so that they could revive him someday when the technology's there.
Speaker 5:Well, that'll be fantastic. Bring me back when were you on 9-11?.
Speaker 6:Yeah, well, that's it 3,025.
Speaker 5:We kind of forgot about 9-11.
Speaker 6:What's 9-11?
Speaker 5:Yeah, the whole world's frozen now you?
Speaker 1:chose to end Seinfeld right. What's Seinfeld Larry?
Speaker 6:You're number one, larry. Okay, so they say here data from Gene Hackman's pacemaker shows he was likely dead for nine days before he and his wife were found. The pacemaker shows Hackman's last event was recorded on February 17th, per the Santa Fe County Sheriff. According to the pathologist I think that is a very good assumption and that was the last day of his life. The sheriff said.
Speaker 5:I don't know. The pacemaker was also tracking your every move. I didn't realize that. Yeah, they do do, and if you have an event it gets sent to your doctor.
Speaker 1:It's oh well, it's kind of good, kind of scary, kind of good we're living in the future, I guess. So they sent a message for this the pacemaker well, yeah, yeah, there's data that goes somewhere.
Speaker 6:Whether or not anybody saw it, it sounds like they didn't nine days later.
Speaker 5:And then, of course, his daughter was like I'm very close with the family, but then she didn't talk to him for three months before it's very weird.
Speaker 6:Yeah, what's up with that? It says hackman and his wife, along with their dog, were found dead this week in circumstances officials deemed suspicious enough to warrant a thorough investigation, which is completely different from the first day.
Speaker 6:As authorities investigate their deaths, several items have been taken from the couple's home two green cellular devices, which is very specific sounding like cricket phones, I guess green phones, along with three medicines and this is where it's different too, because a lot of people overdose on, like barbiturates, and you know that's how they die. When it comes to pills, it's a thyroid medication and tylenol and a high blood pressure or chest pain medication.
Speaker 5:Well, as we learned on OK Bud this past week, you can be allergic to ibuprofen and Tylenol, I guess. So Autoimmune disorder? Yeah, but I don't think he was.
Speaker 1:I guess one of the bottles had a skull and crossbones on it.
Speaker 5:You don't want to take that one. Why did you even give it to me? Just a test? No, just to see your willpower.
Speaker 6:Also seized by the sheriff's office were records from MyQuest, which is a medical diagnosis service. So that's the pacemaker service yes. The causes of death for Hackman and Betsy are still still not known. The pair did not know any external trauma or did not show any external trauma, and there was no immediate signs of foul play.
Speaker 1:But just a foul smell yeah, I'm sure of that.
Speaker 6:According to preliminary autopsies and officials, uh, there were also no immediate signs of a carbon monoxide or natural gas leak, they said all right, I was shocked when they came with those results.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I would have put all my money onto that yeah, here we go.
Speaker 6:This is an update. The couple's bodies were found in separate rooms in their secluded house, with scattered pills found next to betsy. Investigators have not yet determined whether hackman and uh arakawa, her last name, died at the same time. So this is just so weird. He's 95 years old, I mean she's 63, which obviously you can die at 63, but not immediately at the same time right someone else.
Speaker 6:It's fairly young these days, young absolutely yeah, he's 32 years or senior, so it's just, it's very odd. I did see someone on twitter write something that to me is the most logical sounding theory at this time that Gene died. He's 95 years old. You can drop dead at any time at 95. And she wanted to be with him, so she took a bunch of pills and that's why she was near the pills when she was found.
Speaker 5:I think the dog did it and committed suicide. Whoa. Dog killed Gene Hackman. The dog killed Betsy. Then the dog took the pills because he couldn't live with himself. Wow.
Speaker 6:Holy shit, that's not your Twitter idea.
Speaker 5:Take your Twitter in, shove it right up your taint.
Speaker 1:And he told the other two dogs save yourselves, save yourselves.
Speaker 5:You don't want to be near me right now.
Speaker 1:Get out of here while the getting's good Get out Guys, I'm turning rabid. Yeah, I'm wondering. So in that theory she kills herself, why does she have to take just one of the dogs with her? Was that her favorite?
Speaker 6:Well, I think the dog was just trapped inside and couldn't feed itself. The other two were outside, so they had access to food and water.
Speaker 5:I suppose nine days of dehydration would do that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that poor dog yeah. I mean obviously All of them. Well, everyone yeah, imagines being the dog.
Speaker 6:Like really confused every day I imagine being a dog investigators are working to piece together a timeline by analyzing a planner found at the home and cell phone data, including phone calls, text messages, events and photos all right, they're also going to be interviewing the maintenance workers, who are the people who called 9-1-1. Listen to this because, yeah, when call.
Speaker 6:Yeah, when they first came out with the story they said the door was wide open and in this 911 call that is not the case. They're saying they're locked outside and they can see the bodies through the window.
Speaker 1:Oh, okay, and I've heard 911 calls at murder scenes and whatnot. This is one of the freakiest sounding ones ever. It's very odd.
Speaker 2:He's very spooked Summit Drive down at the gatehouse. I'll meet you over there. I'll meet them over there. I'm the caretaker for the subdivision. I'm going to bring them up here. Are you with the patient now? I'm sorry. Are you with the patient now? Yeah, I'm over at their property there's this operator. So I have to meet the ambulance or the police. Whoever down at the gatehouse, I'll bring them up here. Okay, how old is the patient? I have no idea, you don't know.
Speaker 2:Okay, that's fine, is the patient, a male or a female? A female and a male probably, I don't know. I don't know, sir, just send somebody up here real quick. Okay, are they awake? I have no idea. Are they breathing? I have no idea. Are they breathing? I have no idea. I'm not inside the house. It's closed.
Speaker 6:It's locked. It's closed. It's locked.
Speaker 2:But I see that she's laying down on the window. Okay, they appear to be completely awake.
Speaker 6:No pal.
Speaker 5:How many times they appear to be awake or alert. I wouldn't call you, because then they would be alive.
Speaker 2:No, no, no, no, no, no, it's not. No, they're not. Dustin hoffman, did you ever hear? Did you hear them?
Speaker 4:talk or cry? No, no, he found them. Are they moving?
Speaker 2:at all. No, dude, they're not moving. No dude seriously okay, my units are underway, okay I don't know.
Speaker 5:I know it's a tough job in a 911 operator, but that guy was so annoying yeah, even other 911 operators have said how bad of a job that guy did. There's two bodies in there. They're both dead. Are they breathing? Are they? Is one combing their hair?
Speaker 1:are they crying? It seems like his lunch was being interrupted seriously.
Speaker 6:Yeah, that's um, it's very odd. I don't. I can tell the police said the door was wide open. That would be odd. To just report, alejandro, we were talking off air about this, but he was saying the guy might have just been very scared to go in. It might have been open, but he was too scared to go in and didn't just admit that Could be.
Speaker 5:Who knows, it was going through a lot and then he has to deal with that guy. If you're talking, about nefarious circumstances.
Speaker 6:It does make a difference if the door was wide open.
Speaker 5:Oh, absolutely. That means someone left and was freaked out and had to get away quickly, but there was no signs of theft or anything like that, no, which I'm sure they would have reported at this point.
Speaker 1:But he was so spooked that he couldn't put any words together. He couldn't even say that it was a man and a woman or who they are, nine days decay. He didn't even want to say possibly dead or not moving. He was being as vague as possible.
Speaker 6:Yeah.
Speaker 3:Not that we got what he was saying eventually it's very easy, but that operator was confused.
Speaker 1:So they're moving right, no.
Speaker 5:So you're calling me because everything's just fine.
Speaker 1:You just wanted to chat.
Speaker 5:Were the corpses alive when you, if you try tying strings to their arms and seeing if you can make them a puppet.
Speaker 6:Yeah, so I mean it's very odd. Even his daughter, like you said, said that she hadn't talked to him in months, which also sounds weird. Like oh, I haven't even seen or talked to him in three months, guy's 95.
Speaker 5:like oh, I haven't even seen or talked to him in three months, guy's 95, you're not checking in once a week well then there's a question of how much was his hollywood catalog worth? Did they want him dead?
Speaker 6:oh he's also 95 years old, yeah it's all. Yeah, no, it's tough to say we are going back to randy quaid and his theory about the hollywood star whackers yeah, randy quaid, a man who had sex with a rupert murdoch man.
Speaker 5:Of course you'll know him as cousin eddie.
Speaker 6:Yes, shitter's full shitter is full some say randy would be full of shit. Uh, we don't know. We don't know. He claims to know about this. You know cabal that goes around killing actors and actresses for money.
Speaker 5:I wonder why he would still be alive then. Or maybe they just want him out here as a psyop. It could all be part of the plan.
Speaker 1:But you don't know how many attempts there may have been that he's made it. He thinks when there's egg he can't catch the guy and the arrow hits the wall behind him, as always.
Speaker 6:Let's see. He was saying that Gene Hackman and his wife are murder victims. Some scumbags did it and staged it. Stop talking about the films he's in. Oh sorry, pal. Uh, this is how they get away with murdering famous people. Fake news starts generating film clips. How is it possible that I know at least six people who have died like this? Caridin hackman ledger question mark.
Speaker 5:I mean Carradine died choking himself out while he jerked off Heath Ledger. That was so unbelievably sad.
Speaker 6:Yeah.
Speaker 5:Well, you never know, randy Quaid, cousin Eddie, he might be on to something.
Speaker 6:He's on something. He's definitely on to something.
Speaker 1:And he doesn't want to talk about the movies.
Speaker 6:No, because that's where the royalties come in.
Speaker 5:It's a lot. You know, Randy's got a lot on his mind.
Speaker 1:I'm sure he was worth a lot.
Speaker 5:Do we want to do this clip of the sheriff's office?
Speaker 6:Yes, let's do it.
Speaker 5:Let's hear what the cops have to say to counteract Randy. Yeah, exactly, they're going to work this case. They're going to look at every aspect and and figure out, try to figure out the exact cause. And I again, I think the autopsy is going to be key and the toxicology. But again, in my experience you know that that could take a while and we will keep you updated on this story. We can do, okay, bud updates.
Speaker 6:Yeah, and obviously we're not going to be able to solve this mystery today. Uh, hackman is going to be honored at tomorrow's academy awards. So by the time you guys hear this, uh, people on patreon are listening already, but if you're not on the patreon, you'll be hearing this after the academy awards is going to be a powerful presentation. Yeah, dedicated to hackman oh man.
Speaker 5:But what if we find out? Much like monday night, raw dedicated an entire show to chris benoit oh, if we find out that perhaps it was the other way around. Hold that 95 year old hackman went on a hacking rampage kills the dog kills. No, that's 100 speculation.
Speaker 6:However, we're allowed to speculate. We're not journalists here it does come out.
Speaker 5:Well, there's no such thing as journalism anymore. But if it does come out that that's the case, it'll be very interesting yeah, not that.
Speaker 1:I think that is the case. And dusty released a statement. Quote gene was like brando and that he brought something unprecedented to our craft, something people didn't immediately understand is genius, powerful, subtle, brilliant, a giant among actors. I miss him already.
Speaker 5:Yes, yes, indeed he does. We'll pull up some linoleum and let's go have a nice sandwich on dustin hoffman and think about gene so let's get into final thoughts so I think we should just go over quickly the possible theories.
Speaker 1:I think maybe, if it's the game of Clue, we have Betsy where she was distraught after he died With a candlestick. Dog died, hollywood Star Whackers. Hollywood Star Whackers. Ben mentioned maybe the dog. No, oh, yes, the dog did it.
Speaker 6:The dog did it for sure, or Gene did it. The dog did it for sure, or Gene did it.
Speaker 1:Or Gene did it Absolutely, which would be very upsetting.
Speaker 6:Yeah, then there'd be two mean genes out there in the world.
Speaker 5:An allergic reaction to ibuprofen perhaps you know.
Speaker 1:And, dare I say, maybe the landscaper. No, we leave the landscaper alone, leave the landscape for a load, because the door was wide open and he said it was shut.
Speaker 5:He was stressed. I think the guy who woke the 911 operator is closer than the. He probably did it yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, this is very fascinating, though. Yes, 95.
Speaker 5:What a life, yeah. Good long run, no matter what happened. 95. Damn near a century of life, yeah. And a damn fine actor, damn fine actor, good guy rip do you guys hear that what you've got mail.
Speaker 6:We've got ourselves a mailbag to close everything out here.
Speaker 1:Yes, so we got a nice message from jane doe. Oh janee, With the passing of Michelle Trachtenberg and Gene Hackman. I bet you guys are pretty busy, so I'll keep it short. Great episode and guest Never thought I would learn this much about Jerry Springer, but here we are. You guys are my favorite podcast, so keep up the great work.
Speaker 5:Thank you so much, jane Doe. And watch the Autopsy of you Fantastic movie, the Autop much Jane Doe. Yes, and watch the Autopsy of you Fantastic movie, the Autopsy of Jane Doe, great horror movie, really surprisingly good.
Speaker 1:And Kimber Danny wrote loved period, everything period. Oh, thank you.
Speaker 6:So sweet. Yes, also, we have a four star from Brandy Red. Ben Brought Me is titled.
Speaker 5:Can we get the extra star? Yeah, it was one more star.
Speaker 6:What's a?
Speaker 5:fourth one Well, thank you.
Speaker 6:Came here for Ben and I really like it, but sometimes it's a little biased and facts are left out or just wrong. Still like, and I'm actually a Patreon member. Yes, I've seen you on there, thank you, we love you, but also we're allowed to be biased here. We're not journalists. We can speculate, we can do whatever we want.
Speaker 1:Yeah, Well, again there is no such thing and facts are left out. I mean, yeah, did you hear today's episode we?
Speaker 5:didn't leave anything out. We didn't get anything wrong either. The dog fucking did it Exactly. Take my word for it. I'm a podcaster and a comedian.
Speaker 6:Yes, so we appreciate you. Thank you for being on the Patreon. If you haven't joined the Patreon, if you're listening right now on one of our Spotify or Apple, any of the podcast platforms, you can join our Patreon. Ten bucks a month. Hi, bud, we have two podcasts one Patreon OK bud and Death and Entertainment.
Speaker 5:Five episodes a week? Yes, watch them live and contribute, as a matter of fact, do we?
Speaker 4:have any comments.
Speaker 5:Yes, they're chit-chatting.
Speaker 6:They are. Vanessa said the Benoit thing was nuts. I still remember the tribute and then the whoopsies later on.
Speaker 5:That was halfway through the episode. They found out and they were like so we don't miss him anymore.
Speaker 6:Pano man is saying great episode, great tribute Alejandro. Let's hope he didn't go the Benoit route.
Speaker 1:Totally true. Wow, so that's gaining steam.
Speaker 6:Kelsey said, learned a lot about Hackman tonight. A legend to the end.
Speaker 5:Well, thank you all so much for watching, thank you so much for listening.
Speaker 4:Mm-hmm.
Speaker 6:All right, everyone Hail yourselves and until next week, don't go dying on us. Talk to you soon. Bye.
Speaker 3:You have just heard.
Speaker 6:A true Hollywood murder mystery. I have never seen anything like this before.
Speaker 4:The movies, Broadway, music, television, all of it.
Speaker 1:A place that manufactures nightmares.
Speaker 3:Okay, everybody. That's a wrap. Good night. Please drive home carefully and come back again soon.