Death In Entertainment
Kyle Ploof, Alejandro Dowling and Ben Kissel discuss Hollywood murders, true crime, on-set deaths and more!
Death In Entertainment
The 1989 Snow White Catastrophe (Episode 157)
The 1989 Oscars went so poorly not only did it kill the career of producer Allan Carr-- it killed HIM. Join hosts Kyle Ploof, Ben Kissel and Alejandro Dowling and tune in to an all new episode today!
Death in Entertainment is hosted by Kyle Ploof, Alejandro Dowling and Ben Kissel.
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Hey there, darling listeners, it's me Snow White, and I'm here to spill the poisoned apple tea. You may have heard about Disney's disastrous live-action remake of my story, but, if you can believe it, it's not my first rodeo. Once upon a time in the glittering land called Hollywood, I was plucked from my cottage in the enchanted forest and dropped straight into the star-studded chaos of the 1989 Academy Awards. Rob Lowe appeared like a rogue prince that night, except instead of a daring rescue, we broke into a duet that haunted a billion viewers. The reviews were brutal. They didn't think I was the fairest of them all. It was even worse for the show's producer, alan Carr. Not only did it kill his career, but it killed him. It's no fairytale ending Today on Death in Entertainment. Live from.
Speaker 2:Los Angeles on Death in Entertainment. Live from Los Angeles 911,. What is your emergency? Here in Hollywood now Two counts of murder.
Speaker 4:Injury and death.
Speaker 2:Oh, my God.
Speaker 5:Shocking new details. That has stunned the entertainment world.
Speaker 3:This makes me a little nervous. A hair stood up on my arms Just like in the movies.
Speaker 4:What do you call this thing anyway?
Speaker 3:Death In entertainment.
Speaker 7:Greetings Ditto Universe. Hi there, what's up? How the heck are you? My name is Kyle Plouffe, I'm Ben Kissel and I'm Alejandro Dowling. Thank you all so much for listening to this episode. Go to patreoncom, slash diebud and you can watch every single episode live and comment. And then we read the comments and be part of the show. Okay, today's episode, snow White, it's not just a major motion picture, it was also a total shit show at the Oscars in 1989. Whoa, and we're going to talk about Alan Carr.
Speaker 8:Yeah, he had a fairytale career that ended as a nightmare.
Speaker 7:And we're just going to warn you we're going to have some laughs here on this show. We are a true crime and celebrity death comedy podcast, so even though there's dark stuff, we're going to laugh about it, okay.
Speaker 8:And you'd have to laugh a little bit. If you're covering the Snow White segment at the Oscars, I would imagine. I would hope so All the time. There's something wrong with you if you can't laugh at that.
Speaker 7:What if you just take it super seriously, which I think they?
Speaker 8:actually did. Oh, some certainly did yes.
Speaker 7:A little too much. So this is an original Grimm's fairy tale.
Speaker 4:Yeah.
Speaker 7:Not the Disney-fied version. My mom bought the original Grimm's fairy tale for me when I was a kid the book, the book and that was the one where Cinderella's stepsisters cut off her feet yeah, cut off their feet or toes so they can fit into the slipper, yeah, and I was like this is pretty gory. She's like what are you reading? I was like your Christmas gift. They are pretty awesome, though. They are awesome.
Speaker 8:And Snow White is very dark itself, the itself, the story, because the queen is trying to murder her yep and that hunter is supposed to cut out her heart. I mean my god, right, yeah, cut out my heart and put it on my sleeve. You know what I mean. Let's get started Before we go to 1989,. I would like to cover the current Snow White controversy. Ooh, I don't know if y'all are following this.
Speaker 7:Yes, it is very controversial yeah.
Speaker 8:And why is it so controversial? It started a few years ago. The star Rachel Ziegler, who was cast as Snow White. She thought that it would be better to get rid of Prince Charming.
Speaker 7:Yeah, sure, they also seem to for some reason bring geopolitics into it and they talk about Palestine and Israel on a regular basis. During the press tour, yeah, which has turned some people off, gal gadot was in the israeli military she'll kill you, and ziggler is super pro-palestine. So it's like, okay, let's put these two together. Yeah, if that was an actual cage fight, gal gadot would tear her apart like celebrity death match, god.
Speaker 8:And on top of that there are reports that on set, ziggler was trying to direct Gadot during the scenes. Oh my God.
Speaker 7:I wouldn't do that.
Speaker 8:Yeah, I think for Gadot it's the most embarrassing thing she's ever done. Besides that, Imagine video during the pandemic. Oh, that was awful, but even that's a little better than this Snow White movie, I think. Yeah, it's supposed to be a big disaster. It's coming out soon.
Speaker 7:Yes, they delayed it. It was supposed to be out like a year and a half ago.
Speaker 8:Was it.
Speaker 7:Yeah, it's been a long time. Then they had the seven magical beings, and then that was a disaster.
Speaker 8:Can you talk about that?
Speaker 7:So it was just they wanted to like lgbtq it up all the disney movies. But how does that involve dwarves? The dwarves, the dwarves were uh, that is considered old school. That is out of date, out of touch. You're not supposed to call anyone a dwarf, even though dwarves themselves are actually diagnosed as dwarfs, and that's what they're called dwarfism. Peter dinklage says don't say it anymore. Well, all right, well, I'll go with the dinklage.
Speaker 7:I'm gonna go with little people but little people is the preferred term yes, and if you are a little person acting in hollywood, they just took seven roles away from you. And then the seven magical beings. They were so ridiculous when the pictures came out that disney freaked out was like, okay, we need to bring the dwarves back and instead of hiring actual dwarf actors, they just did it cgi last second, so they're all like uncanny valley.
Speaker 8:Yeah, stop weird recreations of the original cartoon dwarves.
Speaker 7:I can't believe we can't make snow white and it's just make snow white.
Speaker 8:It's very easy, yeah and then, of course, her name in the movie is snow white, because she was rescued in the snow, or something her skin was white as snow well, that's the original book. Yeah, that's the original book. Yeah, that's the original story, but they changed it because she's of Mexican heritage. Yeah, she's a spicy.
Speaker 9:Latina. Now Is it Mexican.
Speaker 8:I don't know. Okay, we can cut that. If it's not, I don't know. But yeah, she's of Latina heritage. So instead of having skin as white as snow, she was rescued in the snow.
Speaker 7:okay, as a kid she's colombian, so they could have been in the coke trade. Okay, there you go. I love that version of snow white. Hell yeah, snow white and the movie blow just kind of merge into one blow white yeah, yeah.
Speaker 8:So that is coming, coming out and Disney is bracing itself to lose a bunch of money. Great People are up in arms about it because you know people don't want their fairy tales changed too much. Right, you know, yeah.
Speaker 7:Just make the movie, just do it or make it easy.
Speaker 8:Or make a new movie Right With the stuff you want to do with it.
Speaker 7:I think them delaying it and making just, they've also, uh, amplified the controversy. Yeah, just put the fucking movie out yeah, it's good people will like it, and if it sucks, they won't. They canceled the red carpet and everything.
Speaker 8:Yeah, it is like they are trying to sneak this in under the radar but I have to tell you guys, this is not the first disaster with Snow White.
Speaker 7:Okay Now let's go back in time to 1989. Sweet, you got my Aquanet, bro. Bro, did you fucking?
Speaker 8:slam Samantha. Yeah, this is indeed the world of Ninja Turtles. Neon shorts, batman, batman, yep, batman, absolutely, oh yeahtles. Neon shorts, batman, batman.
Speaker 7:Yep, batman, absolutely. Oh yeah, you're right, batman, the Batman. I want to say like hyper color shirts were out where, if you were a fat kid like me, it would just make your tits purple.
Speaker 8:And always white shirts too. Yes, that showed everything. Yeah, but I didn't care. And fanny packs, classic, still wearing them. So alan carr, he was a big bombastic, producer, bombastic, and he was tapped to produce the 1989 oscars, which celebrates the movies of 1988.
Speaker 7:okay, if that makes any sense, it does okay I guess we don't know what the movies of 1989 are, yet this was the year of Rain man. Oh, definitely.
Speaker 8:And Kevin Kline won for A Fish Called Wanda. Did you know that? I did not know that. One of the few comedic performances that was honored by the Academy Awards. Okay, and Alan Carr had been quiet for a little while, but let's go back to how he got started and then we'll find out why he was chosen to host the Oscars. He was born Alan Solomon, so Carr is a stage name. Okay, what do you think of that?
Speaker 7:It was a different time. I'm not really for the stage names yeah, just be who you are. But I also understand. In a business as fickle as Hollywood, you got to change your name sometimes.
Speaker 8:Yeah. So he was born to a Jewish family in Chicago and he went to Lake Forest College, later Northwestern University, always had his eyes set on show business and he was always an investor. He was constantly looking for plays to produce and invest in. Didn't have success right away, but in 1967, he put about $1 1200 bucks into a movie called the happiest millionaire, and then he became the happiest millionaire all right, it was a hit it was maybe not to that level, but it was enough to get him started good and enough to get him to ho.
Speaker 8:So he just kept doing that with little projects, and he made a bunch of money along the way and then through the years he would start to also get into advertising and promotions. One of his infamous events was a black tie party for Truman Capote Capote which took place in an abandoned jail.
Speaker 7:Oh, wow, that's freaking awesome. Yeah, you can imagine the debauchery that occurred in cell 69.
Speaker 8:If those cement walls could talk, They'd puke. Yes indeed.
Speaker 7:The tears, and then Truman Capote bent over and he smoked a cigar not using his mouth.
Speaker 8:In 1966, he founded the talent agency Alencar Enterprises and he managed such actors as Tony Curtis, peter Sellers and the Ann Margaret Beautiful, and she became one of his dearest lifelong friends. Okay, and I guess he also discovered Mark Hamill, michelle Pfeiffer, and are you sitting down, steve Guttenberg?
Speaker 7:Oh, the goon, the goon is loose.
Speaker 8:He just had some trouble with the wildfires. Oh did he? He was all over CNN, Is he okay? Oh yeah, he was helping his neighbors. It's the most publicity he's had, I think, since Cocoon.
Speaker 7:Yeah, he was just out in the middle of the street and they're like what's going on? And he's like saying you know, everything is on fire and I'm trying to help. And they're like who are you? And then goes running back to help people again you gotta know who he is. Come on now.
Speaker 8:In the mid to late 70s, though, Carr's career started to really drive. Hmm, nice. I don't even get the pun, quite yet Vroom vroom.
Speaker 9:Carr driving.
Speaker 7:Oh, I see, God, I'm getting better with picking up these puns.
Speaker 8:He was asked to do the ad campaign for a little flick called Saturday Night Fever. Ooh, and I don't know if you can recall any of the promotional materials for that, but it's iconic. You got Travolta in the white disco suit and you know the Bee Gees and you know Walking down the street, yeah, exactly. So that went over very well, so well, actually, that he became involved in Travolta's next project, grease, nice. So not only was he doing the ads for Grease, but he also invested in it, oh, co-produced the film put in six million bucks Dang. So he was doing all right yeah.
Speaker 8:And I don't know if you know anything about film history, but Grease was the biggest movie of the year and one of the most successful motion pictures of all time, so imagine having invested your own money into it. Yeah, whoa, yeah. He also discovered Olivia Newton John because she was one of his clients and then he suggested she play the part of sandra d wow, so he's all over the place. Yeah, like, if he has an opinion, you probably want to listen to it yeah, that's crazy.
Speaker 7:He's putting up his own money and his own clients in the film too, like we're doing everything. My way doesn't always work out. No but when it does damn, it doesn't work yeah, yeah, I wonder.
Speaker 8:She must have been such a dynamic personality. You could just see it, maybe when she walked into the room. And after the phenomenal success of greece, you can only go down why, he can go up. He did a movie called Can't Stop the Music. I mean, what is this Guantanamo Bay Starring the Village People and Bruce Jenner.
Speaker 9:Well, you know.
Speaker 8:So not exactly.
Speaker 7:Oscar material. Yeah, I actually think Caitlyn would have done better. Oh absolutely yes, with the Village People. Why I'm she a?
Speaker 8:it did win several awards, though the first annual razzies oh, that's not good.
Speaker 7:It swept. Wow, I didn't know.
Speaker 8:The razzies has been around that long yeah, that's when it started, actually around 1980.
Speaker 7:Wow, still going strong, I mean if're going to make a bad movie, make the worst bad movie, yeah.
Speaker 8:Exactly.
Speaker 7:Get a Razzie, why not? Can you go accept a Razzie? Oh yeah.
Speaker 8:A lot of people have.
Speaker 7:I think Natalie Wood did it, didn't she?
Speaker 8:That was a different. That was the hasty pudding from Harvard Right that was. That was way before the Razzies. But Holly Berry did for Catwoman oh, hilarious. Sandra Bullock did for All About Steve, and then she won the Oscar the next night for the Blind Side wow, one of the worst movies that could have been a Razzie, too, for the Blind Side that was just because she made so much money for Hollywood.
Speaker 7:They had to give her something, and why not?
Speaker 8:give her it for speed. Good movies, I don't know. Well, he didn't just keel over after. Can't Stop the Music. This show must go on, mm-hmm. So he went and produced a little play called La Cage aux Folles. Oh, it was quite famous, otherwise known as the Birdcage oh, and it was a Broadway smash, wow. So he did have a sense of what could work and what could be successful.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 8:He seemed to do well with the musicals. Well, can't Stop the Music. The Village People.
Speaker 7:Yeah well, not that one, that was a Razzy one. But the musicals? Well, can't stop the music. The village people? Yeah well, not that one, that was a Razzie one, but the other ones.
Speaker 8:And Grease 2 was not as successful as Grease 1. Well, the story had already been told. Yeah, but you're right, musicals are his bag baby, it seems that way. Okay, now he's a big personality in Hollywood and he became legendary for throwing debaucherous parties from his home and you know that this is a party place when it has a name. Oh yeah, it was called Hillhaven Lodge in Benedict Canyon, and people would party there into the wee hours of the morning, snorting lots of things, sometimes drugs, whoa and inside he had an elaborate discotheque and a fully stocked bar and he would hold court there wearing his favorite outfit a colorful caftan and oversized glasses. It's the 80s baby. You never saw him outside of a caftan at that time. What is that? It's like a muumuu.
Speaker 7:It's cozy Nice. He's still from the Midwest at the end of the day.
Speaker 8:True, you got to think of comfort first, absolutely and also, dare I I say, easy to take off oh if that, if you have to go to the bathroom, or if you have to go to the bathroom on somebody or in the bathroom, or in somebody.
Speaker 7:Oh my god, my name is Earl. I'm told I'm playing the role of Toilet.
Speaker 8:So there was a documentary made about Mr Carr in 2017, called the Fabulous Alan Carr, and when talking about the project, the director, jeffrey Schwartz, said, quote Although it was no secret that Alan was gay, he never formally acknowledged it publicly. The word flamboyant was used to describe him as a code word. Let's take a look at a clip from the documentary.
Speaker 5:My guest is one of the most talented driving forces in the entertainment business today.
Speaker 3:He's been called a genius as a producer of the most successful movie musical ever made Grease.
Speaker 11:The 24-hour job that I happen to like very much. My business life and my social life is all mixed together.
Speaker 3:His Hollywood parties are almost as famous as his movies.
Speaker 12:Most people talk about nostalgia, about good old days, and I say to myself and to my friends I mean, these are the good old days, the way they used to talk about Errol Flynn and Humphrey Bogart. We're doing it right now. This is really it. Roll it. I don't want to wake up and go. Gee, I wish I had done that. And that's unfortunately what happens to a lot of people. They wait so long to have the moment and I'm having all the moments right now.
Speaker 8:Ooh, multiple moments, hey Okay, ooh. Multiple moments, hey Okay. Well, he's about to have another moment. All right, oh no, but until then, until the late 80s, this man was having a good time. Mm-hmm, my God, good for him. If only we all could have such a good time.
Speaker 7:Yeah, he's allowed. Don't wait for your moment. No, seize it.
Speaker 8:Oh, seize the moment, carpe diem. You know what I mean, sure. So his health was starting to go a little south. He's not as mobile as he used to be, so he had to get hip surgery. And while he was recovering from this surgery, that's when he got the call to produce the 1989 Oscars telecast. He was all hopped up, yeah, oh, 1989 Oscars telecast. He was all hopped up, yeah, oh. So yeah, he was riding high off of La Cage the kids call it La Cage. Yeah, thank you. Thank you, ben. No problem, it's hip. So Carr first met with President Richard Kahn in his hospital recovery room. This is the Academy Award president. Yes, okay, not the Academy Award president. Yes, okay, not the president of the United.
Speaker 7:States. Yeah, because I was like I don't remember that between Jimmy Carter and Ronnie there.
Speaker 8:And later he held a press conference right in his front yard in Beverly Hills. So he had multiple homes Hillhaven Lodge you know what happens there stays there, right, but Beverly Hills, that was. You know what stays. What happens there stays there, right. But Beverly Hills, that was. You know his day place. Yes, less less cummy, less semen there. Yeah, it was a little fresher and the bathrooms were used for going to the bathroom.
Speaker 7:Oh, okay.
Speaker 8:Unique. So at this press conference he erected a six-foot statue. Yeah, he did, sure, he did. Well, he was excited for this gig. Nice, he put up a six-foot statue of Oscar. Very cool. I mean, you need to have that in the background if you're hosting a press conference from your front yard.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 8:I guess so.
Speaker 7:How'd they decide on Oscar for the award? What is Oscar?
Speaker 8:Who is Oscar? You know that's a really good question. The.
Speaker 7:Academy Award statuette is popularly called the Oscar because former Academy librarian Margaret Herrick thought it resembled her uncle Oscar.
Speaker 4:That's cute.
Speaker 8:A librarian. Librarian margaret herrick thought it resembled her uncle oscar.
Speaker 7:That's cute, nefarious prize that's been given to so many heinous people.
Speaker 8:It was some librarian that went that looks like my dear uncle oscar we'll go with it done.
Speaker 7:Oh, it's nice, it's one of those.
Speaker 8:Yeah, an oscar, yeah, oh yeah, let's try to get one. Have you ever?
Speaker 7:held one? No, I have not. I've held an Emmy, and it makes you want to stab somebody in the eyes. Oh yeah, Perfect murder weapon. I've held a man named Oscar.
Speaker 8:Okay, so you hung out at Hillhaven Lodge yes, well, that was actually Kyle's uncle and it was a whole thing At the Paramount Studios tour, you can hold an Oscar. Oh, okay, so I got to hold one. It's heavy. They say that. Yes, it's true. Wow, it's a lot heavy, Like you almost fall to the floor when you pick it up.
Speaker 7:Whoa, yeah, somebody wasted their entire speech talking about the weight. I think it was a Culkin. Yeah, I think it was a Culkin. Yeah, culkin did that this last time. He's like this is heavy. It's like, I guess, an anorexic woman just held it for 15 minutes.
Speaker 8:Yeah, I was going to say Angelina Jolie managed to hold it just fine. Yeah, but when she was saying that she was in love with her brother.
Speaker 9:Oh, that's right, yeah.
Speaker 7:We forget that Angelina Jolie, don't we, we, we do so.
Speaker 8:he said that it was the highest honor you can get from the Academy other than winning one to be the host. Times have definitely changed on that. Yeah, definitely Nightmare. And can you believe that back then you were not paid for producing the Oscars?
Speaker 7:It's exposure baby. It was free. It's like the halftime show for the Super Bowl, Exactly.
Speaker 8:Yeah, it was considered reward enough to produce it.
Speaker 7:Oh, that's nice, just to be around all those wonderful stars.
Speaker 8:After the front yard press conference he was just always going to the media and promising the biggest spectacle you've ever seen. Okay, and there's going to be glitz and glam and movie stars, whoa. And then he had an interesting idea let's book the Great.
Speaker 7:White yeah. And make sure the ceilings are super low and do pyro.
Speaker 8:Yeah, let's light some fireworks indoors. Sweet, he might as well have done that. What could happen? Well, he had the idea to get rid of the host Quote. I just want as many great people as we can possibly get. We're casting the presenters as if we're casting a movie.
Speaker 7:But that's going to make it more difficult. Well, who's going to like I don't know organize everything, like a host is kind of needed.
Speaker 8:Well, they had presenters do that throughout the show, but there was no one host, there was no through line with, like when you go to a comedy club and they the comedian brings on the next comedian.
Speaker 7:Yes, that's it.
Speaker 8:And then one of his other changes actually has stuck to this day. It was his idea to get rid of the phrase and the winner is, and instead have them say and the Oscar goes to Wow, all right, because he thought if you're nominated, you're already a winner. All right.
Speaker 7:I like that? No, you don't. That's a loser's mentality. Oh boy, you're not. If you're nominated, it is an honor to be nominated, I get that, but you're not a winner. I, if you're nominated. It is an honor to be nominated. I get that, but you're not a winner. I mean, you aren't a loser In life, you're a winner. Yeah, sure, but you still would have lost the.
Speaker 8:Oscar, because you get a lot of publicity. You have a $100,000 gift bag.
Speaker 7:Oh, that's worth it. It's worth it.
Speaker 8:And what if you're not nominated? Wouldn't you rather be one of the five nominees? That's kind of a win.
Speaker 7:Yeah, of course. No, I'm saying yes, indeed, but also but you're a loser.
Speaker 8:In a sense. So he kept hyping it up. He said that the Shrine Auditorium was going to look like an Easter basket because he was flying in 6 million tulips from Holland. Oh God, this is not good.
Speaker 7:Million tulips from Holland. Oh God, this is not good. All right. And he's not getting paid for this, no, he's spending his own money to do this.
Speaker 8:Yeah, wow, holy shit, but remember, this is the guy that produced La Cage. Kyle. He's used to taking these risks, yeah, and maybe it'll pay off in other ways.
Speaker 7:You live in Holland. All of a sudden, the tulips are all gone. You're like what's happening? Oh, alan Carr's producing the Oscars.
Speaker 8:Or you're having a tough year and your farm's about to close. You're like nobody's buying tulips anymore. Then you get the call Six million tulips that's like the scene in Tommy Boy Half a million brake pads. Carr then held another press conference to show off one of the sets, which was a flashy recreation of the coconut grove nightclub from the classic days of hollywood, and then he vowed that it was going to be the most beautiful academy awards that anyone has ever seen. Was he Donald Trump? He's beautiful and that it would be anything but tacky. Contrary to what some people feared, that didn't stop Los Angeles Magazine from writing a snarky article about him, and they commented that some of the more conservative board members were scared about what he had up his sleeve. Oh please.
Speaker 7:It's a little stuffy. There's a couple of cocks up there. Who cares? Whoa.
Speaker 8:Yeah, little stuffy buttholes Back at Hillhaven, yeah, so let's watch this interview on Good Day Live. For some reason, they have him paired with Michael Caine. Oh, and Alan Carr is promoting the big night.
Speaker 6:Why does anyone take on the enormous proportions of producing the Oscars? Is it an honor or is it kind of an incumbent thing, where it's incumbent upon you, once in your career, to take this on Because it must be an enormous undertaking?
Speaker 11:Well, first of all, it's not for the money, because we do this job for free, right. And since I'm a child of the movies, growing up in Chicago, and remember first hearing it on the radio and then watching it on television, it's something I always dreamt that I wanted to do, but I never thought they would ask me. I guess they thought I was too pushy or flashy or not establishment enough. But this year they came to me and said would you do it? And I was just thrilled. And the key to having a good show is starting early. I started in October. I think you're going to see one of the best Oscar shows ever. We have more stars, more genuine glamour, I think, probably more humour and it's probably for one thing, it's the most beautiful Oscar show ever. We have 12 set changes that are all to do with staircases and draperies, and everyone has put their best foot forward. You're even getting dressed up, aren't you, michael?
Speaker 4:Yeah, I've got a brand new evening suit. Are we paying for it? No, you're not paying for it.
Speaker 7:I have my bow tie cleaned. Okay, classic Hollywood A little nasally.
Speaker 8:And, if you'll notice, he's wearing a quiet jumpsuit instead of his caftan Understated. So I guess the hip surgery humbled him a bit.
Speaker 7:I mean, I would wear the muumuu after the hip surgery for sure. Yeah, true.
Speaker 8:Yeah, that is an interesting time to pivot to the neon jumpsuit. Yeah, it's more difficult to get in and out of, I guess.
Speaker 7:The elastics are holding them together.
Speaker 8:Oh could be. Yeah, and he might have had helpers, Maybe. Yeah, Carr had seen a campy musical Review in San Francisco. By the way, Review is another name for play, for the layman out there, Thank you. I did not know that. And this play was called Beach Blanket Babylon, and Carr thought it was absolutely fabulous. The basic premise is that Snow White bids adieu to the seven dwarves and then she travels the world in search of prince charming.
Speaker 7:So rachel ziggler would hate this yeah, well, she likes that they got rid of the seven dwarves true so it's 50 50. And what's wrong with prince charming? People see that they're demonizing prince charming.
Speaker 8:I don't need no man yeah, her thing is that she doesn't need to be rescued and that he kisses her in the original without her consent Because she's sleeping, yeah, so he should have just left her to die in her apartment, I see. So Carr loved this show so much that he called the creator of it, steve Silver, and said hey, can you help me adapt it for the Oscars? And they devised a new story where Snow White was now arriving in Hollywood after she left the Seven Dwarfs and she's bright-eyed and bushy-tailed.
Speaker 7:She thought she was saved, but oh my.
Speaker 8:God.
Speaker 7:What they did to Snow White in Hollywood.
Speaker 8:Yeah, yeah, they don't know how to handle Snow White, do they? No, they don't. But get this. They hired composer Marvin Hamlisch to do the music for this segment and write lyrics to new songs. How do I know this man? Marvin Hamlisch is the Oscar winning composer who did the Sting, among other classics. He has done so many movies and he's a legend, but this was not his finest hour. It's not gonna well, he is dead now, but it's not on his gravestone. Let's put it that way the 1989 Oscars.
Speaker 8:And then for the role of Snow White, this aspiring actress named Eileen Bowman won the role. She showed up to audition for what she thought was Beach Blanket Babylon, and she did an interview with the Hollywood Reporter in 2013 and talked about her experience. Did an interview with the Hollywood Reporter in 2013 and talked about her experience. So she says quote Steve Silver asked me how are you with the famous people? I thought well, they're like anybody else. Then he said you got the job. And so then, when he asked her do you know what you're auditioning for? And she said beach blanket Babylon. And he said no, honey, this is for the Oscars. Whoa. So it was her first paid job. She got scale, about 350 a week. And then they had secret rehearsals on the Fox lot, as secretive as the production of Eyes Wide Shut. They didn't want anybody to know this was going on.
Speaker 7:So the people performing in these nightmares are getting paid, but he's not getting paid for putting it all together. He's paying. That's crazy, yeah.
Speaker 8:Well, how else are you going to get talent involved? I mean, he seems to be thrilled.
Speaker 7:And it's backed up by AFTRA. So that's and he's very rich. Yeah.
Speaker 8:Grease, yeah, and he's very rich. Yeah, grease, yeah, hello, hello, kaj. Now Kyle's learning the Kaj, and then they were constantly reminding her how lucky she was to have the gig and that she technically should be paying them for the opportunity. So they let her know.
Speaker 7:No, technically, you should be paying me Where's she stood. Yeah, should we get to the big night? Let let her know. No, technically, you should be paying me when she stood.
Speaker 8:Should we get to the big night? Let's do it let's get to it. Yeah, March 29th 1989. Ooh, An hour before showtime, Alan Carr was talking to reporters and he told them that it went great during dress rehearsal and so if it's anything like that, he's going to be in show business heaven.
Speaker 7:That ain't good when dress rehearsal is perfect the show is going to stink.
Speaker 8:What's the opposite of heaven At 6 pm Pacific. Okay, so that would have been around 9 pm in his hometown of oh no, 8 pm In Chicago. In Chicago, I should know that because that's near been around 9 pm in his hometown of oh no, 8 pm In Chicago. In Chicago, I should know that because that's near where I'm from and the ABC broadcast opened up with the usual crane shot showing the red carpet and the theater and the arriving stars, so you're seeing Glenn Close.
Speaker 7:Hey my girl.
Speaker 8:Kyle. I, like Glenn Closeyle, sort of met glenn close.
Speaker 7:I said thanks to her and her kids during a dane dane cook. Uh show at the boss, it doesn't matter wow, that's strange.
Speaker 8:I'm sure fans of the show have heard that story before they have, and my doubt of it yeah. But I believe you though, though for the record, I just found it odd that Glenn Close would be at a Dan Cook show.
Speaker 7:I believe it because I don't know why you would lie about it. But yes, it seems unlikely. But it's a life special.
Speaker 8:And then let's watch. I have multiple clips here. The opening number is about 11 to 12 minutes, but I have the greatest hits here, okay, so what we're about to see is there's a variety columnist named Armie Archard who had been interviewing the stars on the red carpet, but now he's introducing the show.
Speaker 10:And now, ladies and gentlemen, here's one of the great legends of Hollywood.
Speaker 7:She's back with us tonight, miss Snow White.
Speaker 10:Good evening, oh, good evening, mr Archer. It is so exciting to be here tonight. I'm a little late, though. Can you tell me how to get into the theater?
Speaker 4:That's easy, snow, just follow the Hollywood stars Follow the Hollywood stars Does anyone have earplugs?
Speaker 8:No.
Speaker 7:Follow the Hollywood stars I think my glass just broke.
Speaker 8:And look at the stars.
Speaker 9:It looks like a regional theater production Are they waiting for Guffman.
Speaker 8:It's a bunch of stars with legs.
Speaker 7:Oh my God, that's hilarious.
Speaker 8:They're all like left sharks from that Katy Perry halftime show. Yeah.
Speaker 7:That's what he came up with. Oh my, and that was the opening.
Speaker 8:Yeah, that was the opening, so that's when people were first introduced to that screechy voice. Right and you'll notice, there are two parodies going on. We got Snow White and the Wizard of Oz.
Speaker 9:Oh yes.
Speaker 8:Follow the Hollywood stars, sure. And the audience is of course thinking who the hell is this lady? Why are there dancing stars on stage? Sit there and enjoy it. Yeah, I mean, I would have been there for the ride. No, it's 80s.
Speaker 7:They're all coked out of their minds. Just laugh a little bit. Yeah, what's?
Speaker 8:the problem. So as she enters the auditorium, she starts greeting all the big stars, and they all look like they don't want to be near her.
Speaker 7:So that's the next clip huh, well, that's been a little rude to snow white. Stars out tonight. Stars with glamour are gleaming and bright.
Speaker 8:Look at Martin Landau.
Speaker 9:He's the one person I love you.
Speaker 8:Right, he's the one person that is thrilled to see her. Check out Tom Hanks' face.
Speaker 7:Yeah, Tom Hanks and Michelle Pfeiffer are not happy.
Speaker 8:Tom Hanks is literally ducking In the annual Oscar parade yeah, in the annual Oscar parade, christopher.
Speaker 9:Guest I'm here for you.
Speaker 7:It definitely seems like Christopher Guest directed all of this, but it's not ironic.
Speaker 10:The 61st Academy Awards. It's so exciting to be back in Tinseltown. I've missed it. So I remember the movie premieres at Grauman's Chinese Theater and the wonderful star-studded parties at the Coconut Grove.
Speaker 7:Why I have so many wonderful, wonderful memories.
Speaker 8:Is that perhaps a Cats reference? You know it's going great when you have to throw in a Cats reference.
Speaker 9:Yeah, you know it's going great when you have to throw in a.
Speaker 8:Cats reference. Yeah, oh, wow. And if you think about it, why are the A-listers so uneasy? Well, it's because they would prefer to be dealing with another A-lister, like when Ellen before she was canceled when she would go out there and take a selfie or vacuum underneath clint eastwood's chair like they were game for it.
Speaker 5:Because they knew who she was.
Speaker 8:Here they're like this unknown person dressed as snow white. What's?
Speaker 7:going on. Oh, they're like. I don't want your stink on me pretty much wow yeah because she's just like oh, they're normal people and they're like no, we're celebrities.
Speaker 8:Very famous ones at that. Not to mention that several of them are up for awards that night. So they're already a bit nervous. Sure, Martin Landau talked about that night many years later in an interview. For some reason they were doing a profile about this and they decided to call him up.
Speaker 7:God, I loved her. You're the only one that seemed to enjoy it.
Speaker 8:He said, quote it wasn't her fault. I empathized with her, Poor Snow White. She didn't have the dwarves to support her.
Speaker 7:Oh, that's nice, I liked her. She could have been my girlfriend. I mean, it wasn't her fault.
Speaker 8:No, of course her. What is?
Speaker 7:she supposed to do.
Speaker 8:She is doing the job she was hired to do Exactly, and she's nailing it. Yeah, for better or worse. Alan Kyra actually wanted somebody famous to play the role at first, and he even called Judy Garland's daughter, lorna Luft, but Lorna declined, saying that it would be perfect for an unknown. But she's worked too hard to be somebody. Oh, okay, wow, so you can see that sort of attitude.
Speaker 7:They're burying this poor girl.
Speaker 9:Yeah.
Speaker 7:Jesus, she's too wrong, she just got cast.
Speaker 8:So Snow White is singing about all the wonderful memories. The way she says memories is so disturbing, yeah. And then that brings us to the Coconut Grove. And guess who hosts this segment? They bring out Merv Griffin oh, Merv. And he comes out singing his signature novelty song I've got a lovely bunch of coconuts. Did you know that that was his song?
Speaker 7:No, that's his song. That's his song.
Speaker 9:I thought it was.
Speaker 8:Jimmy Savile's. And then he introduces the golden age movie stars, and Alan Carr considered this part to be his biggest achievement Because he thought he was going to wow the audience with bringing back these famous A-listers from yesteryear. Wait till they see this. And there's a couple of stars who did turn down the invitation, like Lorna Luft had to play Snow White, lana Turner and Ava Gardner said no Because they wanted people to remember them in their prime and they kind of had the right idea. So let's look at this segment.
Speaker 4:Good evening and welcome to the fabulous Coconut Grove where every night is exciting. Meet the stars Mr Buddy Rogers, mr Sting, Mr Will Sting, what's going on?
Speaker 2:Mr Tony Martin, his beautiful wife, Sid Charisse.
Speaker 7:Are they about to win a new car?
Speaker 8:Yeah, come on down Now there's a weird hoedown going on, yeah they just trotted out the corpse of every old star of yesteryear, all right, and you know what? That reminds me of that bit that Andy Kaufman did, where he has that old lady riding the toy horse.
Speaker 7:Oh yeah.
Speaker 8:And then he keeps increasing the speed of the music and then she has a heart attack, yes, and everyone thinks she's dead. That's what those stars look like on the stage, and this was the first Oscars, also, that Bruce Valanche was one of the writers. Oh, all right so he was involved in this fiasco.
Speaker 7:Good old Bruce.
Speaker 8:Gotta love Bruce. And here's an interview of Bruce Valanche talking about that portion of the Snow White segment.
Speaker 3:The Golden Age stars were not as you remember them, they were all older and they kind of were brought in from Palm Springs and it wasn't very glamorous to see Dorothy L'Amour being carried across the stage under the armpits by two guys and wearing thick glasses, because she really couldn't see where she was going. And Alice Faye and Tony Martin were older, and Roy Rogers and Dale Evans really didn't leave the table, and all of these people who had been legends in their times were not as you remember them. So instead of the audience going oh my God, oh my God, they were going. Oh my God. It was a series of those things.
Speaker 7:Oh my God, Bruce Valanche, the nonpolitical Michael Moore, yeah, and did you see his?
Speaker 8:shirt, kyle, I didn't, it'sice from the brady bunch chained up oh, alice in chains yeah, nice that's bruce baby. Alan carr was a visionary, so although he's paying tribute to classic hollywood, he also wants to stay current Yep. So it was time to introduce a modern day movie star, and that's our next clip.
Speaker 2:Isn't it exciting. Snow, Isn't it thrilling.
Speaker 9:It gets better Meet your blind date, Rob Lowe.
Speaker 7:Blind date huh.
Speaker 8:Oh, mr Lowe, I wish I was deaf. I'm such a fan.
Speaker 2:Really, I'm a big fan of yours, Snow, but you know there's so much I'd like to know about you.
Speaker 7:Are you 15?
Speaker 8:What's the age of consent in the dark forest? I love Disney. Starring in cartoons every night and day.
Speaker 9:But you said goodbye. Consent in the dark forest. Ha ha, ha ha. Oh boy, oh Jesus, yeah.
Speaker 8:You think, john Fogerty?
Speaker 9:was proud. Oh, keep the cameras rolling, baby. Oh no. Oh, no, oh boy.
Speaker 7:This is the best show I've ever seen in my life. I wish I could remember this.
Speaker 8:I was eight years old Rob Lowe said that he just had to do it because being asked to perform at the Oscars was like being asked to go to the White House.
Speaker 7:Yeah, absolutely. You can't say no to that.
Speaker 8:No, I'm not upset with anybody performing. That's fantastic, and Eileen Bowman said he was terrific to work with and that they bonded because they both realized how scary it was to do that in front of a billion people.
Speaker 7:Yes, yes, I mean, this is live, we're live.
Speaker 8:If you can believe, believe it. The number goes on and on and on yeah, it's like 12 minutes let's fast forward into it another minute or two and see where they're at the tables are dancing. You got dancing furniture like Beauty and the Beast on acid.
Speaker 7:Yeah, I am utterly confused. So is everybody else Right? Yeah?
Speaker 8:Now let's listen to Rob Lowe's recollection on the Joe Rogan experience.
Speaker 9:Okay, I could tell just from the first bar that it was going to be bad.
Speaker 7:Yeah, when you were singing, when you were singing.
Speaker 2:No fine Singing lessons. I look out in the middle of the audience and I see Barry Levinson. So he's at this on this Oscars. He's about to win literally 11 Academy Awards. As an actor, there's no one you would want to impress more than Barry Levinson. It's the year of Rain man and I look out, joe, in the middle of this, and I see his face. I'm not kidding, and this is what he literally was going. He went like this what the fuck?
Speaker 1:I see him mouth the words what the?
Speaker 2:fuck that's amazing. And so talk about bombing. We, you know we have to have our, our, our actors denial, like we can't get through a career without a healthy dose of denial. So I'm like you know what fuck barry levinson, what does he know anyway?
Speaker 8:that's incredible and he goes on to say that. Afterwards, backstage, he ran into some old woman who said I didn't know you were such a good singer. Yeah, and it was Lucille Ball oh fuck, that's all you need Wow.
Speaker 9:If.
Speaker 7:Lucille Ball compliments you, you're good.
Speaker 8:She died a month later. I think she was on her way out. She didn't know, she didn't know, she didn't know the reality of what was happening. So the opening segment continues and they sing another song together, although Snow White takes the reins. And then there's more dancing. A bunch of ushers come out and start kicking like the Rockettes, and then there's more dancing. A bunch of ushers come out and start kicking like the Rockettes, and then a replica of what was then known as Grauman's Chinese Theater Now it's the TLC Chinese Theater that gets wheeled out, and it's odd, snow White looks like the final boss in one of the Adventure Island Nintendo games or something. She has this huge outfit on. Let's take a look at that part. And then they're singing Hooray for Hollywood, with, of course, the obligatory change of lyrics.
Speaker 7:Oh, my God.
Speaker 8:There's over the top and then there's whatever that is.
Speaker 7:I mean it's definitely visually striking. Oh, absolutely, yeah, it is. Yeah, it's a real show. I kind of like that one.
Speaker 8:Yeah, and you saw the Chinese theater behind her.
Speaker 7:Yeah, she like became the Chinese theater behind her. Yeah, she like became the Chinese theater. Yeah.
Speaker 8:Well then, snow White fades away and a rolling staircase shows up next to the Chinese theater, and then out walks Lily Tomlin.
Speaker 7:Hey, all right, I just watched a great documentary on Dolly Parton. Ooh, and the segment on 9 to 5 with her and Jane Fonda and Lily Tomlin is fantastic Classic movie, one of the best. Yes, dabney Coleman, 5 to 5. A great song which, dolly. She created it while watching people perform and she started playing her nails and that's where they got that sound, she's like oh, that sounds like a typewriter. So literally in the song there is a nails performer and it's her.
Speaker 8:What a genius. She's the best. Lily Tomlin walks down the stairs and she loses a shoe. Oh no, on purpose.
Speaker 7:Like Cinderella, it was planned Okay, but that's like kind of that's a deep cut.
Speaker 8:And then she gets to the microphone and says welcome to the shoe. I mean, show the shoe, it's tough, is this thing on, it's tough? And then, mercifully, they cut to a commercial Oof. Wow.
Speaker 7:So it's just the beginning. People are just like what the hell was that? Yeah?
Speaker 8:So what did you guys think of the segment itself?
Speaker 7:It was something I mean. It wasn't boring, it wasn't, I don't know. I think they're trying.
Speaker 8:Yeah, they're trying. They are trying. Come on, they're going for something.
Speaker 7:It's definitely an Alan Carr fever dream. That's pretty much it.
Speaker 8:Backstage, while Rob Lowe was talking to Lucille Ball, eileen Bowman ran into Kyle's friend Glenn Close. Talking to lucille ball, eileen bowman ran into kyle's friend glenn close, hey, who looked at her and said well, hi, snow white. Well, that's nice, some people are being nice to her. And she said she and rob low were asked to attend the governor's ball and that they were supposed to stay in character. I just don't. And then she put her foot down. Wow. She's like no, I'm not going to be a dancing monkey anymore.
Speaker 7:No, I'm done being Snow White. Is she done with Snow White now? Yes, okay.
Speaker 8:Yeah, she can start to decompress. Yes, unwhite herself. Yeah, and she went to a dressing table and ran into Olivia Newton-John and they were sharing makeup. Oh, that's nice, because Olivia, I guess, hadn't gone on stage yet. That's the nice thing about the opening number You're done. You're done. It's like a stand-up show. If you get on first, then you can relax after that.
Speaker 7:Who wants to be the headliner, with all the money and fame and glitz? Exactly, you want to be the opener.
Speaker 8:And Olivia Newton-John asked her how did you ever do that, how did you ever get out there in front of that many people and do that?
Speaker 7:That's such a backhanded compliment. It's like when you get off stage and someone's like so how do you feel?
Speaker 8:Yeah, there was one more very cheesy segment in the Oscars that night. It was called I Want to Be an Oscar Winner, oh boy.
Speaker 7:And it featured. Is it in the same tone as Oscar Mayer Wiener Pretty?
Speaker 8:much, and they were billed as today's brightest young stars, and those stars included Patrick Dempsey and Ricky Lake, okay and Corey Feldman.
Speaker 7:Another reason why we see what he's become.
Speaker 8:And this segment was introduced by Lucille Ball and Bob Hope and, as I mentioned, that was her last public appearance before dying one month later. Wow, what a way to go out.
Speaker 7:Yeah, the worst Oscar award ever. That's better than the mid.
Speaker 1:You know, just be the worst.
Speaker 7:If you're the worst, be the worst. This is the Razzies of Oscars here.
Speaker 8:The rest of the show was standard, though. I mean, what do you want with the Oscars? People won awards, they gave speeches. What do you want with the Oscars, right? People won awards, they gave speeches, dustin.
Speaker 7:Hoffman won Best Actor for playing a disabled guy.
Speaker 8:No, he was, oh my goodness.
Speaker 7:I forget.
Speaker 8:Or a challenge. He was real smart, autistic.
Speaker 7:Oh yeah, there you go. Yeah, but there was, anyway, he was real smart, right, a savant, yes, a savant, that's what he was. They used to hey, but it's not nice. Yeah, I'm saying what they used to say.
Speaker 8:And Rain man did win his best picture. Tom Cruise's heyday, well, I mean, I think he's still in it.
Speaker 7:He doesn't stop.
Speaker 8:At first, alan Carr thought to himself hey, this went pretty well. Okay, it's feeling good. Yeah, because he thought in-house yeah, everyone kind of liked it. Yeah, in-house yeah, everyone kind of liked it. Yeah, he thought that there was all the humor and the glamour that people would expect from the oscars I liked it.
Speaker 7:I enjoyed that. Actually it's better than you know just a person going up there saying a couple of jokes yeah, it's a whole spectacle yeah, it made no sense like yeah, even if it's bad, it's something fun to make fun of while you're watching it with your friends.
Speaker 8:Yep, there's a book called Inside Oscar which is a lot of fun to page through because it tells all the details of behind the scenes at the Oscars, from the promotional campaigns to the night of the Oscars and afterwards. It's so political, yeah, the Oscars, and afterwards it's so political, yeah. So there's a part in that book where they say that Alan Carr was snippy to a reporter in the press room when questioned why he chose to use Snow White, and he barked. It's called theatrical, yeah but there's the movies.
Speaker 7:Yeah Well, that's a good point. He would have crushed the Tony Awards for sure, oh, that's true, that's true.
Speaker 8:And he would have crushed Tony. Yeah.
Speaker 7:To add, there was Put his hip back into place.
Speaker 8:So it was starting to hit him that maybe some people didn't like it.
Speaker 7:It's 89 dude. Everyone is just looking up from their glass table after doing a line of good cocaine, just being like oh yeah, it looks about right, alice. Hey bro, do you see snow white on stage, or are we just super fucked up? Is that a dancing table?
Speaker 8:imagine you just lit up a joint and you turn that on. Holy cow, what a gift that would be. Exactly Alice Faye was not happy. She was one of the Golden Age movie stars featured and she complained that she felt like a glorified background extra with just three seconds of screen time.
Speaker 7:She should be happy. She should send a thank you note for having three seconds of screen time. What's she so proud about?
Speaker 8:She should be happy, she should send a thank you note for having three seconds. It could have been five.
Speaker 7:She's in a retirement home in Palm Springs and now you're complaining.
Speaker 4:I think it hurt the performance. I should have been in longer.
Speaker 8:The next morning, the reviews were brutal. The next morning, the reviews were brutal. The New York Times wrote that the opening number deserved a permanent place in the annals of Oscar embarrassments. And that was one of the kinder reviews. And get this Right now. It's just kind of funny, right, like it was over the top, it was campy and some people were annoyed of it Big deal. Well, it became serious when Disney Corporation filed a lawsuit for copyright infringement against the Academy over the quote unauthorized and unflattering use of the Snow White character snow white character.
Speaker 7:This was gonna be my theory about why shit went so south after, because the walt disney corporation is a terrifying organization that will come down on you yeah and rain, hellfire, and so I that's I'm glad that this actually happened, because, well, I'm not glad that it happened, but it sucks. Yeah, it's just it. It's no wonder why he was treated the way he was after this. Now they need to stop demonizing the Snow White gal.
Speaker 8:Yeah, she just tried her best, and they of course did not create Snow White, but that was clearly a model of the cartoon Snow White, right? Oh, so that's why they were suing them, because they had secondhand embarrassment. Yeah hand embarrassment. Yeah, and frank wells, who was then president of the walt disney corporation, stated that he was not going to take any further legal action against the academy. As long as they said, I'm sorry for what?
Speaker 7:for what? A fantastic opening fucking number For having a vision. Why would I apologize for that? Apologies are overrated.
Speaker 8:He died in a plane crash in the mid-90s. Whoa Okay, but the reason that Disney was suing them actually goes a little deeper than just being embarrassed. They had recently teamed up with MGM Studios for the theme park, which was movie-themed. Yeah, is it not MGM anymore?
Speaker 7:Hollywood Studios.
Speaker 8:Yeah, okay, and Disney had wanted to promote it during the commercial airtime of the Oscars, but they were turned down because the Academy thought that would imply an endorsement.
Speaker 7:That's hilarious. And then the entire number is their character. I kind of see where Disney is like. Wait what?
Speaker 8:And then, to work around that, disney got clever deal with Chevy and produced a minute long ad that featured Illumina sedan in front of the Chinese theater on the new MGM studios lot, and out of the car comes the seven dwarves. And guess what? This was the first commercial to air that night, which means that it directly followed the Snow White segment. That's incredible. So Joe Stoner at home was like what the fuck?
Speaker 7:was that.
Speaker 8:He's now seeing this commercial and he's like, oh man, disney's really eating it tonight. But really they had nothing to do with that segment. But, it sure looked like it. So the Academy wanted to move on as quickly as possible. So the Academy president, richard Kahn, did publicly apologize for quote unintentionally creating the impression that Disney had participated in or sanctioned the opening number. All right, so that's nice. All's well that ends well, right yeah.
Speaker 7:Nothing bad can happen now.
Speaker 8:Not exactly so. The legal troubles went away, but other troubles started to surface, a backlash.
Speaker 8:It's not that serious With Gregory Peck, one of the giants of the industry. That's serious, gregory Peck, one of the giants of the industry. He initiated a letter to the Academy and had 16 of his quote. Equally distinguished peers sign it, and some of these peers include Paul Newman, billy Wilder and Julie Andrews. She later denied knowing about this letter and that that wasn't her signature. In the letter they tore Alan Carr's presentation to pieces, quote it is neither fitting nor acceptable that the best work in motion pictures be acknowledged in such a demeaning fashion.
Speaker 7:Wow, I'm actually happy it happened now, just to see all these actors upset.
Speaker 8:It's ridiculous.
Speaker 7:This is our big night. Yeah, I don't care. Snow White, there you go.
Speaker 8:One famous actor was noticeably absent from the list President Ronald Reagan. Oh Really. According to Alan Carr, reagan woke him up the next morning, calling him to congratulate him on the Oscars, and he told him that that was the best television show he'd ever seen. He's in the throes of dementia.
Speaker 7:I love that. I love that, Alan. That was great stuff it made me feel sane again.
Speaker 8:Made me feel young Like I was back at the Coconut Grove. Then Alan's like well, thank you, ronnie, I appreciate that. The Boston one click, then he goes. What are you talking about? Thank me for what? But there's no record. This ever happened either, by the way. It's just Alan Carr's word. But I believe him, why not? I believe him. The next day he went to Morton's Steakhouse and he goes inside with his arms up like hello everybody.
Speaker 7:Just getting hit with steaks. No oh this is Fuck you. You got an extra hard potato I can throw at this fucking asshole.
Speaker 8:They looked at him like he was a corpse walking in the room. That's brutal, you know, like he's a turd in the punch bowl Right. And then during the dinner there were people that were literally crawling over chairs to exit so that they didn't have to run into him don't let this guy touch me. Oh my god. And that's when it's awful. Yeah, that's when he knew that he was never going to eat lunch in that town again. Wow lord, it's sad, really it is sad.
Speaker 7:I feel bad for him. This is horrible. Yeah, he didn't do anything but try to put on a show.
Speaker 8:So that letter caused a lot of waves. The Academy set up an awards presentation review committee which was headed by a man named Gil Cates, who was former president of the Directors Guild, and their first recommendation was to start paying the producers of the Oscars. There you go. First recommendation was to start paying the producers of the oscars. Hey, there you go. And then they said let's bring back the host and replace the opening number with a funny monologue and that's what we got today.
Speaker 7:Yeah, I think their theory there is that if they do pay somebody, then they have the ability to have the oversight to be like no, no, no, we're gonna do it our way because we're fucking paying you right, right, yeah, even conan had some rules he had to stick to.
Speaker 8:Really, yeah, sure, because you have to represent the academy in a certain fashion. Right, and for one bit it was supposed to be like him and oscar hanging out at home like they're married, and at one point the oscar statue is on the couch. But they said no, no, no, you can't have Oscar sideways.
Speaker 7:Oh, he's got to be standing up a lot of times. Yep. All right, oscar needs to be erect. I guess.
Speaker 8:So Just like old Uncle Oscar, just like we're at Hillhaven. The very next year, the Oscars 1990, gil Cates took over the producing duties and he was paid $150,000. Wow, that's a good show. It's not bad at all. And who did he hire to host who? Billy Crystal.
Speaker 7:Oh well, billy had a run, didn't he? Oh my God, and you know what? He he could do it all, though that's what my grandma used to say he can do it all.
Speaker 8:Song and dance man. Song and dance man. Good jokes, lots of one-liners.
Speaker 7:There was an old comic that told me he saw me at a show. He's like you gotta be a triple threat, you gotta be able to act, do jokes and dance. And I was like what? That's the old school way.
Speaker 8:So Oscars 1990, billy Crystal enters to enthusiastic applause and quips. Is that for me? Or are you just glad I'm not Snow White? I mean, that's classic.
Speaker 7:Boy, did they love that one?
Speaker 8:I'm sure they did, and I just feel horrible, for the Gregory Peck is giving it a standing ovation and Julie Andrews is like in the back seeing if anyone can see her.
Speaker 7:He should have come out dressed like Snow White. I think every Oscars needs to have a Snow White segment now.
Speaker 8:And the next time the character would return to the Academy stage is 1993 to present the best animation short. So they did one of those things where the animated version is there, you know, and it was not voiced by the original actress because she was getting up there and you know, know, who did do the voice is mary k bergman. That's right from south park?
Speaker 7:yeah, what do you mean from south park? She did all the female voices in south park before she committed suicide.
Speaker 8:Yeah, wait what? Yeah, okay, and we did do an episode on that too. Yeah, it's a very sad story, but um, oh crazy. So, yeah, she restored Snow White to dignity after that fiasco.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 8:I bet you're wondering about Rob Lowe's career.
Speaker 7:I mean, we kind of know what it's about, but yeah so.
Speaker 8:Oscars 1989. A couple weeks later, his career might have recovered sooner, if not for a pesky sex tape. Oh, I didn't know he had a sex tape oh yeah, below indeed. So he's getting all this bad press about snow white, and then his sex tape comes to light. Well, I gotta ask how was it?
Speaker 7:I actually have never seen it, but yeah, because you might go to prison why she's underage oh it's cp yeah, oh, yeah and it happened at the dnc oh yeah, so it was.
Speaker 8:yeah, it happened during the dnc convention in atlanta months earlier and it only surfaced a few weeks after the oscars. Jeez, that's crazy, I didn't know that. Yeah, and you know it's big when John Tesh is reporting about it. So let's watch a clip here from Entertainment Tonight, fucking John Tesh.
Speaker 7:I love John Tesh.
Speaker 5:More details are coming to light in the Rob Lowe sex tape saga as the investigation continues in Georgia. Garrett Glazer has that story in Atlanta. Both the sex tape being reviewed by the district attorney and the civil suit against Rob Lowe concern his sexual encounter last summer in Atlanta with at least two women, one of them allegedly a 16-year-old minor. That minor is Jan Parsons.
Speaker 1:She went to high school outside Atlanta until she dropped out last year.
Speaker 5:Classmates here at Lassiter High School say that Jan told them about her wild night with Rob Lowe right after it happened and that she also discussed the sex tape they made. I was going around everybody was like, yeah, jan said that she met Rob Lowe and all this other stuff and she talked about it a lot.
Speaker 7:They went to the high school.
Speaker 8:Wow reporting live.
Speaker 7:They showed her the girl's high school yearbook picture and said her name, which they never do now Different times.
Speaker 8:That was 88?.
Speaker 7:Yeah, 88, 89.
Speaker 8:And that was also when the age of consent in Georgia was 16.
Speaker 7:Oh, okay.
Speaker 8:So legally he's okay, and guess what still is? Wow, isn't that disturbing. Yeah, and that had actually been upped from 14 whoa, yeah, and before that it was.
Speaker 7:If there's grass on the field, play ball, which was the name of the law, which is very bizarre, good lord rob low did settle with the victims.
Speaker 8:Whatever the family I get you know they were going to yeah, bring some sort of civil case, but that was story, is story as old as time, yeah, and then he was sort of in hollywood jail until wayne's world what that's the one that brought him back, and and then the West Wing. How about that? Wow, there's always room for a comeback. Yep and he says that disastrous run in 1989 changed his life. He became sober after that. Oh good, You'd have to, I think.
Speaker 7:Yeah.
Speaker 8:Sex tape and Snow White Mostly the poor singers. Eileen Bowman fled back to San Diego that night of the Oscars and she woke up to a lawyer knocking at her door oh my God, and he had a large folder of papers for her to sign, including a 13-year gag order.
Speaker 7:Oh, almost as old as Rob Lowe's sex partners. So this was Snow White.
Speaker 8:She was Snow White Right. This is the girl that played Snow White.
Speaker 7:And they're like you can't talk about this for 13 years, mm-hmm. So 9-11 is going to happen. You think Orchie can talk about this. Yes, yes, wow.
Speaker 8:An equally horrific disaster 9-11. And it's awful because Eileen Bowman, she's not going to get hired to do anything significant in the industry after this, which?
Speaker 8:is so bizarre because, on the one hand, when she got the role, it probably seemed like a dream come true. Yeah, you're in the room with greatness. She's impressing Olivia Newton-John yes, with her ability to perform under that stress. And then she's punished for it. Yeah, she's. You know, she should have been able to have a career, which she did, like she went into. Um, she went on to do a lot of theater okay, in san diego and is happy now yeah I've seen updates about her. It it's fine.
Speaker 7:But still she did the job. It was supposed to be over the top and campy.
Speaker 8:Yeah, yeah, it's just. And she was all over the news right afterwards too, just like Rob Lowe, and so none of it was good coverage, and if you're a nobody, that's not going to help you necessarily. She says, quote all I can say is what Rob Lowe said Never trust a man in a caftan.
Speaker 7:Wow, they're just burying Alan Carr Jesus.
Speaker 8:She and Rob Lowe did reunite in 2018. Oh, when he brought his one-man show to the Balboa Theater in San Diego. I've done the Balboa Beautiful theater, yeah, and of course they look back with a sense of humor now.
Speaker 7:Yes, I mean it seems like Alan Carr is taking the fall for the most part. Yeah, everyone is running from him.
Speaker 8:Well, let's talk about Alan Carr. His career was never the same again.
Speaker 7:He was destroyed.
Speaker 8:Yeah, you know everyone turned their back on him. At least you know the people that made things happen. He had a lot of personal friends who were always there for him, but he became a recluse. Okay, no more parties. Wow, and he sold Hillhaven to Brett Ratner.
Speaker 7:All right, nothing bad again can happen now.
Speaker 8:Is there some kind of Oscars curse maybe with that place? Because Brett Ratner was supposed to produce the Oscars when Eddie Murphy was tapped to host. But then Brett Ratner went on a crazy media campaign where he's talking about girlfriends with STDs. Howard stern he calls a gay guy the f word it's um publicity event, and he had to bow out of hosting the oscars, though oh my goodness yeah and then they opted to go for the less controversial seth mcfarlane, who did a song called we saw your Boobs Nice. Remember that.
Speaker 8:I don't recall but I do like that. About all the actresses who got naked in movies.
Speaker 7:Oh, very nice. I'm sure Jamie Lee Curtis was mentioned. Yes.
Speaker 8:So he just stayed inside his Beverly Hills home and he was not a happy camper anymore and he turned to food, alcohol, alcohol and drugs to numb his pain oh, I wonder how many people were hitting him up privately, being like we love you, but then just in public they're just like I don't know this guy yeah exactly that's.
Speaker 7:That's hollywood.
Speaker 8:Yeah, that's the most la shit ever you can't have good friends out here they might give him a call to see how it's going, but then in Morton's they're not going to talk to him. But in 1998, alan Carr did have one more good experience because he convinced the studio to release Grease again. Oh okay For the film's 20th anniversary and we have a clip here. So he arranged for Paramount to do a premiere at Grom's, like we did the first time Olivia and the cast showed up.
Speaker 9:Here's Alan Tora.
Speaker 8:Alan reemerged, he loved being back on top.
Speaker 11:This is everything I hoped for. It's the miracle of my life, and it's all come true again. I'm just over the moon, as they say.
Speaker 5:That makes me feel happy to know that he had this phenomenal success after this painful period.
Speaker 4:For Alan it was very much an attempt. It seemed, to get out of his sickbed and say I'm here, I'm alive, I'm well, and that wasn't true. Frailty is not a word you associate with Alan, but he was fighting it.
Speaker 11:I have to stop. I can't understand what's happening.
Speaker 5:He had gotten very heavy again and he was having a really hard time.
Speaker 9:And he could hardly walk and he had bad knees. He had kidney problems. He was on dialysis for a long time.
Speaker 7:That reminds me I've got to take my Wigobi. That's sad, though.
Speaker 8:Yeah, it's brutal, it's hard. He was on dialysis and that wasn't working very well Because he was still drinking and drugging and eating. He went into a massive depression. Yeah, yeah, that's brutal, it's hard. Yeah, he was on dialysis and that wasn't working very well.
Speaker 7:Because he was still drinking and drugging and eating, he went into a massive depression.
Speaker 8:Yeah, yeah, that never stopped.
Speaker 7:Right, I get it. I get it. It's hard out there it is. And then food. You know it's a good comfort. He's still a Midwest boy, yeah.
Speaker 8:And. Us Midwest boys we love our food. He must have went through a lot of Ben and Jerry's after. Yeah, that's my go-to.
Speaker 7:You're more of a sweets guy, I'm more of a savory guy. I hope he at least got fat off of steaks you know just something, At least I hope he had something good.
Speaker 9:Not from Morton's, unless they were handing him out the back like of here, save yourself.
Speaker 7:Yeah, remember that fucking Snow White performance. He orders takeout Drop it on the porch, spitting his food. It was a performance, it was a great show, it was a choice.
Speaker 8:And then friends would try to see him and he would turn them away. He really did not want to be seen or heard.
Speaker 7:God that stinks.
Speaker 8:Yeah, poor guy. And then he died of cancer on June 29th 1999, at his home in Beverly Hills. You?
Speaker 7:know what, if you're going to die 99, that's a great year to die, not at the age of 99. I'm talking 1999.
Speaker 8:He's only 62.
Speaker 7:Yeah, before everything really turns to shit.
Speaker 8:It's before Woodstock, he didn't have to see that. Oh well, it's right about to happen. Yeah yeah, they say liver cancer, but it sounded like he had a whole bunch of ailments.
Speaker 7:Well, yeah, ailments. Well yeah, I mean it was the liver, mostly because of the alcohol and, uh, drugging yeah, his ashes were scattered in hawaii by ann margaret.
Speaker 8:Oh okay, isn't that nice, very nice. Yeah, he was 62 years old oof young guy.
Speaker 7:Yeah, he seemed older than than 62, but I guess that was just the illness and he got success early because that was the 20-year anniversary and he still lived for a few years after that right.
Speaker 8:So I mean early he got in yeah that was the toll of oscar's 1989. Not only did it kill his career, but it killed him. Yeah, wow. And that brings us to Wow.
Speaker 4:And that brings us to Final thoughts.
Speaker 7:You can't trust anyone in this goddamn town. It's such bullshit that all of his friends and peers just totally turned their backs on him and allowed him to be treated that way in public. It is beyond disgusting, and I think there probably were people secretly hitting him up, being like hey, I'm just checking in on you, just to see how you're doing, I love you.
Speaker 7:Yeah, I think he was treated people secretly hitting him up, being like hey, I'm just checking in on you just to see how you're doing, I love you. Yeah, I think he was treated worse than a lot of people who have done much, much worse things. Yeah, and he just tried to put on a show and I thought I watched the entire clip and I thought it was. It didn't stop, it was entertaining.
Speaker 9:Yeah, I mean it was. Yeah, it is stop, it was entertaining.
Speaker 7:Yeah, you couldn't take your eyes off of it.
Speaker 8:It's fascinating, it's a whirlwind experience. You got Merv Griffin shouting one-liners, then you got Rob Lowe serenading Snow White. You got dancing furniture. It didn't make sense.
Speaker 7:Necessarily, I didn't know Merv Griffin was like a song and dance guy. Oh yeah, I thought he was just a game show guy. Truly, all of those old timers, they're all song and dance guys. Everyone had a novelty hit back then, I guess I would say my final thought is don't base your entire self-worth on the opinions from others or your career. You are worthy of love no matter what. Yeah, and yeah, I think that he did not deserve to be treated the way that he was treated and also he did it for fucking free, so actually he paid for it, right. So you know what Oscars you?
Speaker 8:get what you paid for. And it's so stupid because they did pivot to comedians as hosts, which essentially took Hollywood down a peg. But so what's the big deal of the Snow White segment?
Speaker 7:Oh, these actors, they were very pretentious.
Speaker 8:Yeah. Very pretentious I think it just has to do with, yeah, it being too campy.
Speaker 4:Yeah.
Speaker 8:And Gregory Peck was not about to put up with that and in light of some of the later Oscar moments, namely Will Smith slapping the shit out of Chris Rock, yeah. It's so innocent, harvey.
Speaker 11:Weinstein.
Speaker 8:Harvey Weinstein yeah. Being thanked by everyone yeah.
Speaker 7:All those people kissing his fucking ass, just stepping on Alan Carr to get to him. Yeah, it's ridiculous.
Speaker 4:Wasn't.
Speaker 7:Harvey Weinstein in God. Weren't they thanked at the most amount? Oh yeah, Probably. For a while.
Speaker 8:And Meryl Streep joked that he was God. Oh my God, so in retrospect, god's on trial. Yeah, poor God. Yeah, this number. It's like who cares, right, who cares?
Speaker 9:Yeah, yeah, this number, it's like who cares, who cares?
Speaker 8:Yeah, like what's the big deal and it's such a great thing to have now like a piece of media Because, I will say, I have a memory of it being probably the first YouTube video that I ever saw. When I first discovered YouTube, that was the first clip I looked up because I had heard about it for so many years and I was so excited that I could finally see it and it is a great piece of media. It is.
Speaker 8:It's so dramatic and when you know the backstory that just adds to it. I think, Wow, you know? Because obviously it's sad, but let's enjoy it in the spirit for which Alan Carr intended it to be. So I say it gets five stars in my book.
Speaker 7:Goddamn right, absolutely Five stars and rate our show.
Speaker 8:Five stars Right, that's a great transition Ben and RIP Alan Carr.
Speaker 9:Yes.
Speaker 4:You've got mail.
Speaker 7:Okay, we got ourselves a mail bag here. Ooh, we have an Apple podcast review. Five stars my new favorite. I stumbled on your podcast since I'm a regular true crime listener and love pop culture. The algorithm sent you to me and I couldn't be happier. I love your pitch black senses of humor and how well researched your stories are. A plus plus, plus, plus, thank you, thank you. Kimber. Danny wrote Pun Master Alejandro on the last episode that we did Big pun.
Speaker 7:Talking about Aperture, yeah, yep, and Lee Evans always shouting us out. He said I think this is the most I've laughed this week. Thanks for the distraction from the dark times Show is amazing and it's like listening to the three cool uncles I never had during dinner. And it's like listening to the three cool uncles I never had during dinner. Thank you Very sweet. Thank you All right. Hail yourselves everyone. Thank you so much. And yeah, check out OK Bud as well. Yes, and the Patreon and go to patreoncom. Slash diebud. You can watch every show live and you can see the things that had to be edited out Specifically. Yikes, when I accidentally All right?
Speaker 7:Well, we'll see the things that had to be edited out, specifically when I accidentally Alright well, we'll move on.
Speaker 8:Yeah, you can take a look behind the curtains. Yeah, they know he's pretty. Anything else, guys, I think that's it Alright, until next week. Don't go dying on us. Bye.
Speaker 4:You have just heard a true Hollywood murder mystery. I have never seen anything like this before. The movies, Broadway, music, television, all of it.
Speaker 2:A place that manufactures nightmares. Okay, everybody, that's a wrap.
Speaker 4:Good night. Please drive home carefully and come back again soon.